WILGA wrote:Only that I do not understand what you are trying to explain.
Only that to move something -as push- over time and distance, you need energy.
Now KSW makes an astounding claim that Starfleet has a way to recover the matter and antimatter they made react together.
Regenerating power?
How is that possible?
We know that the Bussard collectors collect deuterium for fuel replenishment.
But deuterium alone is not enough. They also need anti-deuterium.
Now, from the TNG episode » Liaisons « we know, that the Enterprise replenish its antimatter.
But anti-matter can not be collected with a Bussard collector because there is no anti-matter in space.
The conclusion has to be, that they are able to transform the collected deuterium into anti-deuterium.
Of course, we would say, that this would cost more energy than they would gain.
They'd have to separate quarks and perhaps manipulate their decay to obtain appropriate charges and then recombine them into particles for later use.
If they could do that so easily, they wouldn't even bother transporting antimatter to boot.
It's most obvious that with no reaction being 100% perfect, it would cost more fusion energy than what they could gain.
The only advantage of that would be a very slow recharge of the antimatter stock, and then a recharge of the fusion fuel stock at full, so they would again have access to the greater power outputs due to AM
We could assume, that these technologies or similar technologies are used to convert deuterium into anti-deuterium and that they need for this less energy than the energy that is released in the annihilation of the so converted anti-deuterium with deuterium.
And indeed, the Star Trek - The Next Generation - Technical Manual confirms that consideration.
On page 71 f. is written:
- 5.7 ONBOARD ANTIMATTER GENERATION
As mentioned, there exists in the Ga/axyclass the ability
to generate relatively small amounts of antimatter during
potential emergency situations. The process is by all accounts
incredibly power- and matter-intensive, and may not
be advantageous under all operational conditions. As with the
Bussard ramscoop, however, the antimatter generator may
provide critical fuel supplies when they are needed most.
The antimattergenerator resides on Deck42, surrounded
by other elements of the WPS. It consists of two key
assemblies, the matter inlet/conditioner (Ml/C), and the quantum
charge reversal device (QCRD). The entire generator
measures some 7.6 x 13.7 meters, and masses 1400 metric
tonnes. It is one of the heaviest components, second only to
the warp field coils. The Ml/C utilizes conventional tritanium
and polyduranide in its construction, as it handles only cryogenic
deuterium and similar fuels. The QCRD, on the other
hand, employs alternating layers of superdense, forcedmatrix
cobalt-yttrium-polyduranide and 854 kalinite-argium.
This is necessary to produce the power amplification required
to hold collections of subatomic particles, reverse their charge,
and collect the reversed matter for storage in the nearby antimatter
pods.
The technology that has given rise to the QCRD is similar
to that of the transporter, SIF, IDF, and other devices that
manipulate matter on the quantum level. The conversion
process sees the inlet of normal matter, stretched out into thin
rivulets no more than 0.000003 cm across. The rivulets are
pressure-fed into the QCRD under magnetic suspension,
where groups of them are chilled to within 0.001 degree of
absolute zero, and exposed to a short-period stasis field to
further limit molecular vibration. As the stasis field decays,
focused subspace fields drive deep within the subatomic
structure to flip the charges and spins of the "frozen" protons,
neutrons, and electrons. The flipped matter, now antimatter,
is magnetically removed for storage. The system can normally
process 0.08 m3/hr.
It can be said that the total potential energy contained in
a given quantity of deuterium can drive a starship for some
considerable distance. Applying this energy at sublight speeds
will be next to useless in a desperate scenario. Interstellar
flight at warp speeds requires tens of thousands of times
greater velocities than those afforded by impulse power, and
so antimatter generation will sometimes be necessary. One
disadvantage imposed by the process is that it requires ten
units of deuterium to power the generator, and the generator
will produce only one unit of antimatter. Put another way, the
law of conservation of energy dictates that the power required
for this process will exceed the usable energy ultimately
derived from the resulting antimatter fuel. However, this may
provide a needed survival margin to reach a starbase or
tanker rendezvous.
Of course, the Star Trek - The Next Generation - Technical Manual is not canon.
A pity, it has plenty of neat details.
But the fact that it is written by Rick Sternbach and Michael Okuda can not be ignored. Insofar it seems highly likely that, when this dialogue was written, that the author of the TNG episode » Liaisons « has thought about this ONBOARD ANTIMATTER GENERATION.
Those guides were already ought for use as a source of inspiration in the 80s?
It seems to be at least consistent with all available facts - especially the fact, that Voyager looked for deuterium several times but never for anti-deuterium - while I do not know a better explanation.
It's a good one, but I don't expect a high recharge rate, and I think it fits with dialogue. The question by Byleth confused them as they may have through Byleth was asking how much AM they cold be collecting.
Hence WTF by both Worf and Geordie.
It's still a
complete different fish to what KSW claims with energy regained from the collapsing warp bubble and antimatter and matter reforming in the warp core after that.
KirkSkywalker wrote:Mr. Oragahn wrote:KirkSkywalker wrote:And I explained that as well: E=MC^2, and the First Law of Thermodynamics.
No, that's just appeals which I would describe as, at best, vague smokescreens.
Or maybe I'm simply talking over your head-- and in SDN fashion, you denounce as impossible what you don't understand, simply because I don't
teach it to you.
In a debate, you can't demand that-- not unless you have a lot of audacity.
Yes I can. I want proof that you understand what you type and that it explains anything of what you claim, as simple as that.
Please show that the UFP can do that.
By
reversing the initial M-AM reaction-- again, E=MC^2.
Please prove they can reverse matter that has been annihilated. Matter and antimatter don't really combine. It's not Transformers or Super Sayan.
As for the First Law of Thermodyamics: Creating the warp-bubble requires a lot of energy; thus when they come out of warp, that energy has to go somewhere. You show no evidence of where it goes, and therefore the default explanation is that they return it to its pre-combined state.
Your position is speculative.
What makes you think the energy doesn't already and constantly go somewhere during flight at warp?
Just to get things clear here. N-space is your way to call what we generally call realspace, or normal space, right?
No, not "my" way-- it's standard astrophysics, I didn't invent it.
Prove it.
Thus far you only give me the impression of throwing sciency sounding terms just to cover a lack of substance to your claims.
Yes, I cited a clear example from the episode "Resistance". Power constantly needs to be supplied over a certain threshold to maintain the warp systems on. And that's for a very new class of ship.
You never cited any episode, and even here you ignore that Voyager's powerplant was
damaged in the pilot-episode.
And never repaired?
They managed to repair their ship after countless attacks over the years, but never gave a try to repairing the warp core?
Also, I already spoke of an example
here.
In your dreams... twice. "{{GIGGLEZ!!!}} >snort snort! < 8-P"
The point is that power regenerates; if it does so out of warp, then it can do so even faster at warp-- up to a point.
Even IF they could (assuming they can collect matter while flying around at warp), we come to a point where I don't see that resplenishing their AM stock, because I don't believe that warp travel is free in the end, without considerable loss of energy and matter.
