Strong Economy?

[Mr. Oragahn]

Actually, basic Keynesian theory is both valid and easy to understand. It holds that, during periods of economical growth, state must accumulate wealth in order to help sustain, and then repair, economy during periods of economical recession.

And Obama is a Friedmanite too. He sanitates corporations, but doesn't help workers - who actually run the economy (or rather, what's left of it). Meanwhile, instead of helping economy, giving stumuluses to small and medium business, US and EU Central Banks are busy feeding corporations and buying off their own debt? WTH? You pay off debt after you get economy back on the track, not before it.

http://petrblt.wordpress.com/2009/09/28 ... le-nation/

http://inequality.org/equality-and-growth/

http://www.houseofpaine.org/bonziebean/blog/?paged=8

Ok but that's off topic. If you have anything to debate on regarding Obama's economical program, please post it elsewhere.

[Mr. Oragahn]

Damn, I really need to clean up my "Death Star cost" text file; I may not present it as it were, but there's like a whole mass of information I had gathered that's terribly relevant to this thread. But I have correction to make to it first. Stay tuned!

[KSW]

Actually, basic Keynesian theory is both valid and easy to understand.

Absolutely! As shown in the diagram, the water falls and powers a turbine, runs uphill, and falls back down and powers the turbine again, providing constant energy.
And it's the same with economics:

It holds that, during periods of economical growth, state must accumulate wealth in order to help sustain, and then repair, economy during periods of economical recession.

Yep-- like that!
Perpetual motion, like perpetual money, just HAPPENS!

[Mr. Oragahn]

Steady guys, this is not a thread to debate Keynesian economics. Please don't pollute it.

[KSW]

No, it's about economics, and so pertains to the argument that a strong economy depends on timely and accurate information, and thus access to communications-media, in which telecom is valued according to cost-benefit.
Meanwhile Keynesian arguments say that it's not needed, i.e. that a times of abundance and scarcity just happen, and governments just need to react accordingly during fat and lean years.
Yeah.... like that.

[Mr. Oragahn]

No, it's about economics, and so pertains to the argument that a strong economy depends on timely and accurate information, and thus access to communications-media, in which telecom is valued according to cost-benefit.
Meanwhile Keynesian arguments say that it's not needed, i.e. that a times of abundance and scarcity just happen, and governments just need to react accordingly during fat and lean years.
Yeah.... like that.

It's totally theoretical and what we're looking at here is facts from books.
I see where it can go: someone will argue, someone will disagree, and soon enough, the point of this topic will be lost.
What you're doing is engaging in a debate about economical doctrines, while we don't even need to refer to models, but merely point out the issues which anyone can understand by merely reading quotations. As such, it will be perfectly demonstrated when I'll provide a rearranged version of my file, as I did find interesting elements I had forgotten about.

Regarding the second Death Star, I routinely point out that the rate of construction exactly was ten times superior : they built a station nearly twice as big as the first one, and five times faster (4 years instead of 20).
The intensity is what increased ten fold, and this would have an obvious impact on the economy, or whatever is left of it.
The only reason a man would "sanely" go for the option of a much bigger, and thus logically, much more powerful station, would be to make sure that its Death Star remains the most powerful one.
Why so? Because the plans for the first one did end in the hands of the Rebels after all.
Otherwise, it's nothing more than pure, unadulterated egotistic madness.

On the topic of currency and logistics, I'd suggest reading the following thread:

SW Fleet Logistics (Rebellion, GE)

[KSW]

No, it's about economics, and so pertains to the argument that a strong economy depends on timely and accurate information, and thus access to communications-media, in which telecom is valued according to cost-benefit.
Meanwhile Keynesian arguments say that it's not needed, i.e. that a times of abundance and scarcity just happen, and governments just need to react accordingly during fat and lean years.
Yeah.... like that.

It's totally theoretical and what we're looking at here is facts from books.
I see where it can go: someone will argue, someone will disagree, and soon enough, the point of this topic will be lost.

This comes down to the cost an capability of communications, and the relationship between them and the economy.
Here the claim is put out that they can save money by reducing them, and denying that it's a capital expense. Whateva. Try running a business without a phone, internet, or radio/TV advertising and you'll soon see you'll lose money, regardless of how much you save.

Regarding the second Death Star, I routinely point out that the rate of construction exactly was ten times superior : they built a station nearly twice as big as the first one, and five times faster (4 years instead of 20).
The intensity is what increased ten fold, and this would have an obvious impact on the economy, or whatever is left of it.

Yeah that's a lot easier to do when you rule the galaxy unopposed, vs doing it in secret on a budget to avoid arousing suspicion.
Here we have to look at Palpatine's coup, and how he was able to operate before and after the Jedi were destroyed, and the Senate dismantled. Obviously the more power he got over the galaxy, the more he could devote to the Death Stars, by both devoting resources and keeping them secret in spite of it.

In that light, I'd say that 4 years was far too SLOW.
Likewise, you're forgetting that the second Death Star was nowhere near completed, while comparing to the first one which WAS completed.
Given this, I really don't think that six months is that far out of the ballpark.

The only reason a man would "sanely" go for the option of a much bigger, and thus logically, much more powerful station, would be to make sure that its Death Star remains the most powerful one.
Why so? Because the plans for the first one did end in the hands of the Rebels after all.
Otherwise, it's nothing more than pure, unadulterated egotistic madness.

True, it is like we built the H-bomb once we had atom-bombs, "the ultimate weapon." Mainly, because the enemy was in the process of acquiring it.
Here, they already did.

First, the first one got destroyed within 2 weeks of its completion. That's reason enough to go back to the ol' drawing board and reconsider its design.

Likewise, the first Death Star would be considered insufficiently powerful after the Yavin incident, and they'd want to be able to destroy gas-giants, as well, to be able to destroy their moons without giving rebels a chance to escape or counterattack etc.
If the first one had been able to do that, then there would have been no Battle of Yavin-- just the BOOM of Yavin, and the rebel base with it.

Additionally, there is the question of aiming-mechanisms; as we see, the DS2 was able to selectively target and destroy capships repeatedly from a distance, while the DS1 was presumably only built to destroy planets; hence it couldn't provide "artillery" support to the fleets like the DS2 could.
Likewise, the DS2 likely had a tighter defense than the DS1, to prevent smaller strike-ships from getting through as with the DS1.
Finally, the DS2 could likely destroy more planets than the DS1 without re-fueling, and do it in less time; this would make it more formidable in a system of up to a million planets (though not all inhabited).

In short, the DS1 was simply a prototype weapon, and you don't develop the same weapon twice without improving it.

[Mith]

Of course, nowadays the USA and EU economies aren't doing so well from all the massive debt spending, so one would presume that the Empire hid a lot of it's debt, or had some method of having it bought off, ala the USA with China. We certainly know from TCW that the Republic and the Seperatists could and did take massive loans from the Banking Clan to fund their continued war efforts.

Just a correction here:

The US economy didn't take a nose-dive because they borrowed money. They borrowed money to keep the economy from flat out crashing. The debt continues to rack up due to the economy not making a full recovery and the US not being able to outgrow/pay back the debt. The reason for the recession and near depression was that some assholes on Wallstreet ran a scheme where they sold knowingly useless shit to banks, who then sold it to Americans. Then the whole thing collapsed in on itself and the US ran to bail out the banks and the automotive industry to save us from falling into an all out depression.

America itself is stagnating not because of its spending, but due to lack of spending which has been locked by Congress's Tea Party, whose grasp of economics is minuscule to my own, which itself could fit on the head of a pin.

Governments should act accordingly to fat and lean years of course. And the US didn't. We were happily engaging in what, two wars in the Middle-East while our economy plummeted? Then Bush cut taxes, reducing the government's revenue. Granted, it was in hopes of stimulating the economy, but that just didn't work out.



Back to Star Wars.

In Star Wars, it's hard to say. On one hand, you do have massive projects like the Death Star that the government more or less kept out of sight from its populace. You also have Palpatine starting up a whole army of Clones behind the back of the Jedi and the Senate.

But then on the other hand, Palpatine is also a Sith Lord. And the level of corruption within the Republic Senate is absolutely comical at times. To the point that it is actually legal for a Republican bank to give loans to an entity that the Republic is not only at war with--but doesn't even officially recognize the CIS as an entity.

That's...is just remarkable. The amount of power that they have and the amount of corruption within that system is absolute devastating if you can not only get away with dealing with enemies of the state/union, but you can do so legally.

As for the Republic, what a mess. Lush planets like Naboo and other planets like Pantora can suffer severally without space trade for just a few weeks or months. Hell, was apparently under so much pressure from their blockade, that they were willing to leave the Republic. Rodia didn't even suffer from a blockade; they were apparently so poor on a lush, green swamp planet with great big clear domes, that without Republic aid, they were starving. To the point that they arranged a deal with the CIS, stopping only because it backfired on them.

That is just...amazing. How can you be that incompetent?

But then of course, you have planets like Christophis that are highly industrialized and successful worlds. What it says to me, is that the Republic was a colossal failure. Smaller planets like Rodia, Pantora, and those on the Outer Rim were effectively told to go fuck themselves when they needed help, despite the fact that the Republic was no doubt collecting taxes from them. Then of course, you have the Trade Federation, which has so much power, that it not only has its own private army and fleet, but it can blockade a planet whenever they feel like it. They don't even have to go to the Senate to get confirmation that they have a legal reason to blockade a planet. It simply doesn't matter what you do. They've got you by the balls.

More so, look at Padme's own assistants. Apparently, being an assistant to a senator pays shit. Because her assistant's family is so poor, that without food stamps and government aid, they could starve. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd think that someone who is the aid to a senator would get paid at least enough to get by without most forms of government assistance. I mean...fuck. It wasn't even that they were suffering from heavy medical expenses--they literally were just scraping by.

And this girl's family either lived in Coruscant, the heart of the Republic or Naboo, a lush paradise with a massive power generator in the planet's palace.

The Republic is literally the socialist fear of all-powerful corporations doing whatever the fuck they want, how they want, and the people below them can fuck themselves for wanting anything close to regarding a fair wage.

Of course, I would suspect that the corporations would have a bit more power, where robot labor is effectively cheap as can be, therefore seizing up more lower class jobs.

As for Kamino...I highly doubt they built all that shit on their own. Or if they did, they used old schematics or design ideas rather than come up with their own. And wow, the Kaminos must be racking in a killing if they're charging the Republic so much for ships, military supplies, and soldiers that the Republic is literally incapable of choosing between their military and feeding their people. I mean...the Republic is almost a perfect example of Space North Korea. The people at the top get the best of the best...and those at the bottom are left to starve.

Then you get the Empire. Which no doubt also has a great deal of economical and social issues if there can be an actual effective resistant movement within it that eventually causes its collapse. I can't imagine the funds that were sunk into the Death Star and the Death Star II. Entire ISDs cost more than the economical outputs of a planet and that class alone was enough to nearly rip the Empire apart. It's a wonder why they hid the Death Star project; it would have completely shredded the Empire if it was known at the time they started construction, if simply due to the costs (although, it could be that the strain of building the Death Star was what caused the ISDs to be an issue in the first place).

I imagine that the loss of a single ISD caused an accountant to have a panic attack and the Civil War, which lead to the destruction of numerous ISDs, increased the suicide rates for that demographic.

[sonofccn]

@Mith sigh...I apologise for this but...

I'm afraid I have to disagree. Which is unsurprising since I am one of those Tea Partiers. here sums it up fairly well. The US is broke, we've kicked trillions down the drain as stimulus, TARP and Lord knows what else. The US has perpetually for years spent more money than it recieves in taxes and I'm afraid the time has come to pay the piper. As to "Bush cut taxes" here Goverment revenue went up until the financial meltdown.

Again sorry, I know none of us come here to debate economics and I tried to keep it short and to the point, but I don't know...felt like I needed to say something or other...I don't know...

And back to the regularly broadcasted Star Wars debate.

[sonofccn]

Then of course, you have the Trade Federation, which has so much power, that it not only has its own private army and fleet, but it can blockade a planet whenever they feel like it. They don't even have to go to the Senate to get confirmation that they have a legal reason to blockade a planet.

Well to be fair it isn't like the Trade Federation was allowed to invade member worlds when ever it wanted too, the senate was simply too bloated, disconnected, calcified in beauracracy, and consumed with their own petty issues that they really couldn't act.

More so, look at Padme's own assistants. Apparently, being an assistant to a senator pays shit. Because her assistant's family is so poor, that without food stamps and government aid, they could starve. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd think that someone who is the aid to a senator would get paid at least enough to get by without most forms of government assistance. I mean...fuck. It wasn't even that they were suffering from heavy medical expenses--they literally were just scraping by.

It was supposedly due to the war, implying normally her assistant wouldn't be suffering as badly, presumbly the writers were trying to channel the rationing of the world wars and hitting closer to war torn Europe than the US. Which could suppose Naboo is contributing something to the war effort, warships, army boots, coffins for all the dead clones, or that its social-economical framework was dependent upon the Republic which obviously is now spending towards military equipment.

The Republic is literally the socialist fear of all-powerful corporations doing whatever the fuck they want, how they want, and the people below them can fuck themselves for wanting anything close to regarding a fair wage. Of course, I would suspect that the corporations would have a bit more power, where robot labor is effectively cheap as can be, therefore seizing up more lower class jobs

Actually I've had similar thoughts, actually how many people do we see working legitimate jobs? There's Dex's diner, owned presumbly by him and operated by droids, Luke's Moisture farm owned by his Uncle Owen and run at least in part by droids, bartenders for well...bars. To the best of my recollection all the buisness we've seen employing people are like this, small personal enterprises. Do big "corps" even hire anything but managment and possibly maintence workers?

[Mith]

@Mith sigh...I apologise for this but...

I'm afraid I have to disagree.

No need to apologize...but you're still wrong. The US government spending money, even borrowing it at a high rate, would not crash our economy. This isn't China. The government and the economy isn't one and the same. That's not even how it would work in China, come to think of it.

Which is unsurprising since I am one of those Tea Partiers. here sums it up fairly well. The US is broke, we've kicked trillions down the drain as stimulus, TARP and Lord knows what else. The US has perpetually for years spent more money than it recieves in taxes and I'm afraid the time has come to pay the piper. As to "Bush cut taxes" here Goverment revenue went up until the financial meltdown.

...It's a clock. That explains nothing. The US spent a shitload in World War I and World War II. You're not honestly arguing that we spent more of our GDP for the past few years than when the US was in all out war, are you?

Now, that's not to say that government spending right now isn't the best or that they always spend it on the smartest things. The fuck up with the solar panel companies is impart, proof of that. But that didn't crash our economies. The war effort that the US has spent its past decade on made America a bit more exposed to the debt, but debt is not what caused the Wallstreet debacle. That's good old fashioned unregulated corporate greed.

If it wasn't for those sacks of shit, our economy wouldn't be in the mess its in now. And don't get me wrong, I prefer capitalism, but regulations are how we prevent incidents like this or messes that BP made in the Gulf of Mexico.

It was supposedly due to the war, implying normally her assistant wouldn't be suffering as badly, presumbly the writers were trying to channel the rationing of the world wars and hitting closer to war torn Europe than the US. Which could suppose Naboo is contributing something to the war effort, warships, army boots, coffins for all the dead clones, or that its social-economical framework was dependent upon the Republic which obviously is now spending towards military equipment.

No. In Europe's case, the war had literally torn apart buildings and much of Europe's industry was torn apart. The Republic is suffering no such heavy losses. Nor does that solve the issue with the Phantom Menace in regards to Naboo suffering heavily without space trade, to the fact that people would starve and shit. It's a lush, green planet.

Actually I've had similar thoughts, actually how many people do we see working legitimate jobs? There's Dex's diner, owned presumbly by him and operated by droids, Luke's Moisture farm owned by his Uncle Owen and run at least in part by droids, bartenders for well...bars. To the best of my recollection all the buisness we've seen employing people are like this, small personal enterprises. Do big "corps" even hire anything but managment and possibly maintence workers?

First off, Tatooine was not part of the Republic at that point, so we have no idea. In regards to droids, it probably varies. In major cities, I doubt that any menial task that a low-educated man could do is done by anything other than a droid. Just as you see that the cops of Coruscant are droids, but with humanoid superiors. That lends credit to the idea that most blue collar jobs on most developed worlds are taken up by the droids. Therefore, most people probably have customer relations, overseeing positions, or jobs that aren't trusted to a droid or there is no practical means of using a droid for it.

In undeveloped worlds, like Tatooine, you probably have people who buy cheap, broken, or used droids that they use as well as possible, which is why you might see someone buy a protocol droid to help out at a moisture farm, even if it's shit at it, simply because that's all you can get.

It would explain why there's a strong amount of political unrest within the Republic to cause tens of thousands of planets to break away; those who have gotten the rotten deal, those who feel they're getting a rotten deal, those who might get a rotten deal, and probably those who are well off, but think they can get a better deal by being an influential member of the CIS rather than part of the Republic.

That said, I don't think that the Republic has a weak industry, just an economy that has died a thousand paper cuts from poor legislation, massive corruption, and corporate sodomy. I mean, when you can argue legally giving loans to the enemy of the people of your nation...that's just...fucking amazing. Then the Emperor took it and rode that crippled economy into the ground with his massive militarization projects, the ISD, the Death Star, and not to mention the occasional BDZ of a few worlds.

Yeah, when Tarkain blew up that Alderaan? He destroyed billions, if not trillions of credits worth of income for the galactic economy, not to mention a strong tax source for the Empire. And the Empire destroyed more and more of its assets with every BDZ they performed. Yes, I can see the attractive argument from their view of destroying a "cancer" in their Empire, so that the loss might be worth it, but it did nothing to help the economical issue that the Empire would be facing at that point.

[Praeothmin]

Phantom Menace in regards to Naboo suffering heavily without space trade, to the fact that people would starve and shit. It's a lush, green planet.

Actually, Mith, it's how their economy has been develloped that counts, not just their natural ressources...
Naboo would not die, as you have pointed out they have penty of ressources, but their economy wasn't geared towards self-sufficience...

I could point to a real world example: Canada...
We are a country full of natural ressources, yet without trade, our economy would collapse, and we'd have to re-invent the wheel simply trying to gear our way of doing things towards self-sufficience...
During that period, our people would suffer immensily, not because our land could not support us, but because we wouldn't be used to relying on ourselves, making everything ourselves, we might even lack some important skills, but most of all, we'd also be vulnerable to any predator country wanting to invade: we wouldn't be able to mount any kind of defense...

Same with Naboo...

[sonofccn]

No need to apologize...but you're still wrong.

Me? Wrong? Never! :)

Look here for a slightly more substanional reply.

No. In Europe's case, the war had literally torn apart buildings and much of Europe's industry was torn apart. The Republic is suffering no such heavy losses.

Well Naboo isn't, Ryloth was invaded and looted on the other hand.

Nor does that solve the issue with the Phantom Menace in regards to Naboo suffering heavily without space trade, to the fact that people would starve and shit. It's a lush, green planet.

Yes many worlds are import heavy to a ludicrious degree. Another of Lucas's oddities like the TF having a seat on a government body.

First off, Tatooine was not part of the Republic at that point, so we have no idea. In regards to droids, it probably varies. In major cities, I doubt that any menial task that a low-educated man could do is done by anything other than a droid. Just as you see that the cops of Coruscant are droids, but with humanoid superiors. That lends credit to the idea that most blue collar jobs on most developed worlds are taken up by the droids. Therefore, most people probably have customer relations, overseeing positions, or jobs that aren't trusted to a droid or there is no practical means of using a droid for it.

Such thoughts dovetail brilliantly with how I see it, a galaxy where for the most part "human" work is no more. That the job's market is a narrow slice of niche services and skills, even Anakin for instances was taught to repair droids a relatively knowledge intensive task I would wager, which I think combined with other factiods presents an intersting picture. Quasi-insane rant/posturing below.

In undeveloped worlds, like Tatooine, you probably have people who buy cheap, broken, or used droids that they use as well as possible, which is why you might see someone buy a protocol droid to help out at a moisture farm, even if it's shit at it, simply because that's all you can get.

Well while I'm not disagree places like Tatooine get last years model, through one of the advantages of a fully automated industrial work force should be a glut of product, Owen didn't buy C-3PO just because he didn't have any other choices in droids:

THREEPIO
(quickly)
Sir -- not in an environment such as
this -- that's why I've also been
programmed for over thirty secondary
functions that...

OWEN
What I really need is a droid that
understands the binary language of
moisture vaporators.

THREEPIO
Vaporators! Sir -- My first job was
programming binary load lifter...
very similar to your vaporators. You
could say...

As taken from here

So in essence he bought a droid to translate for him, albiet for another machine becaue in Star Wars computer interfaces apparently peaked circa the '70's. :)

It would explain why there's a strong amount of political unrest within the Republic to cause tens of thousands of planets to break away; those who have gotten the rotten deal, those who feel they're getting a rotten deal, those who might get a rotten deal, and probably those who are well off, but think they can get a better deal by being an influential member of the CIS rather than part of the Republic.

Possibly through for the most part the CIS seems to be composed of the big Corps. The Trade Federation, the Banking Clan ect. But obviously the CIS are less about something than against something, namely the Republic, so it wouldn't surprise me to find hard core Capitalists fighting to get out from under regulations beside Socialists who convinced the corporations own the senate.

But okay crazy rant time/Wild Mass Guessing:

And I apologize again because obviously my political beliefs are going to shadow how I think and perceive random bits of information.

In brief I think that rather than being ganked on taxes planets like Naboo are indeed receiving the largess of the Republic. That the shift from organic workforce to droids created a surplus of populace who, otherwise being a volatile risk to stability, had to be mollified. The easiest would be to add a “living wage” clause to the “social net” placing the bill on the companies who’d get to claim they are “giving back” to the community, they cut down on guys picketing outside their office buildings and the Politicians can sleep a little sounder without fear of torches and pitchforks. This creates a leisure/ artisan/philosophical class unfettered by the need to create, sustained by the “sweat” of the android’s brow so to speak, which over time expands their ranks increasing the toll on the corporations and businesses who in turn began to leave for greener pastures. Merging with corporations on city-planets for power/prestige while setting up operations across the more lawless Outer Rim. The slack of the leaving companies taken up by imports, paid for initially with credits taxed from the remaining corporations then with loans and bonds then with Republic assistance, while the clutter of the ugly industrial sectors are rebuilt into towering cityscape full of gleaming luster and former farmland is given back to verdant and pristine nature, until you have “garden worlds” with a handful of “ruling nobles”, all of whom have an army of accountants who swear their assets are being taxed to the maximum, and fulfilled citizenry who create idyllic cities of wonder, paint serene landscapes and stunning portraits who engage in a thousand and one pursuits of happiness but who don’t produce.

To my way of thinking this explains why verdant worlds like Naboo, materially prosperous by all accounts, are so vulnerable to blockade, why when the Republic starts spending credits in other avenues its basic social-economic fabric seems to collapse, while “dirt-poor” worlds like Tatooine where they farm water condensation had for the average bloke like Owen even under the credit hungry Empire better conditions then what the assistant described. My thoughts anyway.

[Mr. Oragahn]

As for the Republic, what a mess. Lush planets like Naboo and other planets like Pantora can suffer severally without space trade for just a few weeks or months. Hell, was apparently under so much pressure from their blockade, that they were willing to leave the Republic. Rodia didn't even suffer from a blockade; they were apparently so poor on a lush, green swamp planet with great big clear domes, that without Republic aid, they were starving. To the point that they arranged a deal with the CIS, stopping only because it backfired on them.

That is just...amazing. How can you be that incompetent?

I'll have to assume that in a way or another, they signed a deal at some point where they'd be able to leave their planets unmarked by the ignominious sight of food crops (eek!) and would outsource most of its production outside.
Truth said, even if we did see little of Naboo, one thing we didn't see is a single crop field.
There could have been a system like the UNESCO one, where plenty of things are labeled World Heritage and then you couldn't do whatever you wanted with those elements. In exchange of that, the planets would get massive subventions. This, in exchange, may have allowed some planets to live of tourism and artistic activities, and repay the food manufacturing agriworlds with large amounts of money.
There has to be an economical logic to planets such as Naboo, Pantora and Rodia being incapable of growing their own food in due time because of a mere blockade.
These planets aren't like Japan.

The other possibility being that the inhabitants of those planets, having found other worlds willing to produce food, relinquished their own power to do so to become fully hedonistic and therefore became dependent of outer-system sources of food.
That wouldn't surprise me for the Naboo. Even in a galaxy where you don't have to get your hands dirty when dumb droids can do the work for you. I guess they were so up their buttocks that they couldn't stomach the idea of having poor droids forced into slave lavour!
Wouldn't surprise me, considering the silly speech the pseudo-queen gave to R2 in TPM.
Check out Theed in AOTC: the space port has been extended and brought up, but you don't see a single field of crops around. When Anakin and Padmé arrive inside the city, you don't see a single droid. Heck, they have STAIRS! and you see R2 struggling to keep pace with them.

But then of course, you have planets like Christophis that are highly industrialized and successful worlds. What it says to me, is that the Republic was a colossal failure.

Perhaps, like Coruscant, they depend on outsourced food production?
Of course, we didn't see all of the planet and they may grow some of it under ecodomes.

Smaller planets like Rodia, Pantora, and those on the Outer Rim were effectively told to go fuck themselves when they needed help, despite the fact that the Republic was no doubt collecting taxes from them.

There are stupid economical systems where you get subventions after paying taxes. The European Union for example is given money by the states, and then redistributes the money to many regional projects inside those states. Why it doesn't let the countries deal with their own projects on their own, directly, instead of wasting time and money in centralized fiscal bureaucracy, is beyond me.
Now, imagining something worse, and at the scale of the galaxy. LOL!

Then of course, you have the Trade Federation, which has so much power, that it not only has its own private army and fleet, but it can blockade a planet whenever they feel like it. They don't even have to go to the Senate to get confirmation that they have a legal reason to blockade a planet. It simply doesn't matter what you do. They've got you by the balls.

They can even have their leader Nute Gunray dragged to the intergalactic court four times in a row and get bailed out every single time. Class.

More so, look at Padme's own assistants. Apparently, being an assistant to a senator pays shit. Because her assistant's family is so poor, that without food stamps and government aid, they could starve. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd think that someone who is the aid to a senator would get paid at least enough to get by without most forms of government assistance. I mean...fuck. It wasn't even that they were suffering from heavy medical expenses--they literally were just scraping by.

And this girl's family either lived in Coruscant, the heart of the Republic or Naboo, a lush paradise with a massive power generator in the planet's palace.

Remind me when we got info in this please? I'm lost.

The Republic is literally the socialist fear of all-powerful corporations doing whatever the fuck they want, how they want, and the people below them can fuck themselves for wanting anything close to regarding a fair wage.

Of course, I would suspect that the corporations would have a bit more power, where robot labor is effectively cheap as can be, therefore seizing up more lower class jobs.

There are many powerful and huge corporations in the EU, plus a whole independent Corporate Sector that still owes a considerable tithe to the Galactic Empire every year.
This Corporate Sector, as I got it, largely employs biological beings, not droids. It's politically free in some way, and is capitalism gone full speed. That is, more violent than what the Trade Federation did, minus the whole socialism.

As for Kamino...I highly doubt they built all that shit on their own. Or if they did, they used old schematics or design ideas rather than come up with their own. And wow, the Kaminos must be racking in a killing if they're charging the Republic so much for ships, military supplies, and soldiers that the Republic is literally incapable of choosing between their military and feeding their people. I mean...the Republic is almost a perfect example of Space North Korea. The people at the top get the best of the best...and those at the bottom are left to starve.

When everything goes right, this doesn't happen. But the Republic was bankrupt. Look at the US. Food stamps, queues. Is the US North Korea now?
Deputes get huge wages while whatever resembles proletariat suffers and eats shits. yet they find ways to spend millions on damned missiles and drones to kill people you've never heard of, supposedly a danger to world peace (don't laugh).
The Galactic Republic doesn't have to be any different, and I don't see the Galactic Empire being any better.

Then you get the Empire. Which no doubt also has a great deal of economical and social issues if there can be an actual effective resistant movement within it that eventually causes its collapse. I can't imagine the funds that were sunk into the Death Star and the Death Star II.

Huge and huger, especially considering the increase construction rate for the second battle station.
I don't know if you've read the first two pages of this thread but I think we did cover quite a couple relevant point on this question.

Entire ISDs cost more than the economical outputs of a planet and that class alone was enough to nearly rip the Empire apart. It's a wonder why they hid the Death Star project; it would have completely shredded the Empire if it was known at the time they started construction, if simply due to the costs (although, it could be that the strain of building the Death Star was what caused the ISDs to be an issue in the first place).

It's said in one of the EU guides (West End Games or the new ones) that the Empire forced the industry to use modules specifically designed to be used in anything, from a deployable prefab base to an ISD, and even perhaps other space stations and perhaps even Imperial bastions.
Then, by manipulating data with Imperial agents erasing traces, a significant amount of those modules could be rerouted towards the Death Star project.
The mass production of those modules would allow costs to be cut.
It's possible that all those star destroyers (ISDs and else), prefab bases and other stations and bastions were built solely to have a way to produce those modules without having them so blatantly diverted to some black project?
Obviously, designing space ships with the idea that they should be stuffed with modules you could use to pad any kind of superstructure is most likely not going to result into the best space ship design ever, and same goes for all the large ships produced for the Empire.
Let's remember that the modular padding inside the Death Stars could only represent a minuscule section, corresponding to the volume that wouldn't be occupied by pieces and systems exclusive to the Death Stars.
That padding would obviously be part of the battle stations' crusts and the space between the huge elements exclusive to the Death Stars.

I imagine that the loss of a single ISD caused an accountant to have a panic attack and the Civil War, which lead to the destruction of numerous ISDs, increased the suicide rates for that demographic.

Obviously!

[Mr. Oragahn]

Yeah, when Tarkain blew up that Alderaan? He destroyed billions, if not trillions of credits worth of income for the galactic economy, not to mention a strong tax source for the Empire. And the Empire destroyed more and more of its assets with every BDZ they performed. Yes, I can see the attractive argument from their view of destroying a "cancer" in their Empire, so that the loss might be worth it, but it did nothing to help the economical issue that the Empire would be facing at that point.

He freed people from taxation forever, in the most spectacular way!!
That said, this is a very good point. They waste tons of shit to build a station, only to go popping sources of credits.
That's what amuses me so much about the argument that you can have the Empire as it is, but with the Emperor and Tarkin behaving in a non-Sidious way.
Yeah what?