The First 100 Days

[PunkMaister]

You can weigh Obama's standards of democracy against those of Bush here, and observe that... there's no change.

It will take time but people will get it, sooner or later, that it's just a skin job.

More like a flip to the other extreme opposite side of the coin Mr O. I take from your comments that you don't not like hardcore leftists like Obama anymore than you do so called Neocons.

[Mr. Oragahn]

You can weigh Obama's standards of democracy against those of Bush here, and observe that... there's no change.

It will take time but people will get it, sooner or later, that it's just a skin job.

More like a flip to the other extreme opposite side of the coin Mr O. I take from your comments that you don't not like hardcore leftists like Obama anymore than you do so called Neocons.

He's no flip, and the idea that he's a hardcore leftist is laughable for anyone living outside of the US and who has not ingested decades of anti-soviet scaremongering propaganda.
Don't understand that as a defense of communism by the way, because it should not be.

The question would be... how long are people going to accept the merry go round?

The Democrats are just there to give you the illusion, fuel the hope of a better world but never satiate the desire. They come back to maintain living conditions good enough, but not too high, so you're ready to get your head slammed into the shit by the next Bush or other Violence God who will openly ruin your economy, education and health system on the altar of war.
In a way, neocons are less hypocrites. They surely openly lie to their people, but they're far more blunt and obvious in their methods and goals.
Democrats are like snakes.

After the terror and destruction, you get the sexy socialist soothing.
Meanwhile the state absorbs some resources... nationalization it's called, and since the state is pwned by its massive debts to private banks, your money and economy is fucked in the end because the revenues are largely going to be wasted -- but it's not better when it remains private, as medium to high end societies get absorbed by giants which only thrive for money and displace the capital towards finance.

No matter where you go, no wing of the structure truly exists for the betterment of people. It only encourages materialism by sacrificing peace, ethics and tolerance.
They can keep selling their next super religious patriotic zealot or the new black messiah, I don't buy either.
The sad part is that it wouldn't even be worth putting a bullet in their heads, since they're just facade.

[PunkMaister]

Mr O. I am curious is there any US president it it's whole history which you happen to like at least a bit?

[Mr. Oragahn]

Mr O. I am curious is there any US president it it's whole history which you happen to like at least a bit?

:D you had too many presidents for me to care. You need a God Emperor to rule all of Earth for millenia. Makes it easier to keep records.

More seriously, I can't really tell. Perhaps John F. Kennedy. He seemed to start taking... unconventional decisions towards the end of his... err... life?

[Praeothmin]

This is just fancy talks. At best, these illegal immigrants will be welcome to become cannon fodder thousands of kilometers away before they truly become full American citizens, with enough income or capital to live decently... if that's still possible.

I'll wait to see what happens before saying it was a clusterf**k, 'cause it could cause more good then harm, depending on whether your assumption comes true or not... ;)

But is there anything to do anymore now? He has his weapons, he's not willing to use them on people, but just making demos.

Yes, show openness and willingness to work with him, and perhaps convince him to be less of a prick with his people and respect human rights a bit more.
And perhaps, in the long run, disarming his weapons...
The hard-a** approach sure hasn't brought anything good, so why not try a more intelligent approach?

It's bullshit. There's that crisis, which is no accident by any fucking means, there's that Obama guy placed and financed by the guys behind this crisis, there's the people he put in his government's financial arm who are the culprits (I mean, guys, just check the names for God sake), and he's selling you this formidable recovery plan to save you with your own money, and probably with lots of money borrowed, again (which would more or less nullify the possibility to refuse banks to immediately repay the bailouts, and even perhaps grow the debt even more), and he's the saviour?

Yet that bullshit plan has been copied by pretty much every country around the world because they also thought it was the way to go.
Wonder why?
Perhaps it was because they all felt it was the only viable solution.
I'm no economist, but since the mojority of the Economic world thinks the proposal is the way to go, I guess I'm inclined to believe that, in the current situation, they're right.

And there's also something that needs to be realized by a lot of people:
We know the system needs to be changed, but this current system has been ingrained in our culture for so long, it is so big, and there will be so many people opposing any change (and powerful people at that), that any true, earth shattering change will take some time and a lot of efforts from everyone.
100 days?
Barely enough time to change anything.
Before you actually try to rebuild a bridge, first you have to make sure the bridge will still support your heavy equipment, and if you divert one lane to another while replacing it with a new one, the lane to which you divert traffic needs to be able to take it.

Did Obama even attempt to remove the Patriot Act and the god awful numerous other Acts that mess up liberties?

Would the removal of such acts be accepted by everybody?
I very much doubt that...
Would the (no doubt) hard negociations to remove those acts be done in the public eye?
I don't think so...
We don't know why no move has been done, so we need to wait.

It's easy to criticize after 100 days, but how much change can actually be done?
I'm encouraged at least by what seems to be a more diplomatic approach, and I'll wait at least for a full year to have past before I start flaying him on the publc space... If I do... ;)

[ILikeDeathNote]

Well, I guess one thing we know now after 100 days is that the President doesn't know where his own plane is

[PunkMaister]

Well, I guess one thing we know now after 100 days is that the President doesn't know where his own plane is

LMAO!

[Jedi Master Spock]

More like a flip to the other extreme opposite side of the coin Mr O. I take from your comments that you don't not like hardcore leftists like Obama anymore than you do so called Neocons.

I will also disagree with you on this. Obama is center-left within the American political spectrum - i.e., he falls reasonably close to the median value for Democrats (hence the very small differences between his platform and Hillary Clinton's during the primary season), and right now, Democrats outnumber Republicans. Gallup gives around a ten-point gap.

So while he falls on the left side of the mainstream American political spectrum, he's fairly centrist for an American politician on the whole. Certainly no more extreme within the American political spectrum than Bush.

The positions he takes are generally not extreme - on gay marriage, on abortion, on health care, polls show Obama has chosen fairly popular positions moderate within the American political spectrum - and on the global scale, US politicians are not an especially liberal breed. More liberal than some, less liberal than others.

[Praeothmin]

Well, I guess one thing we know now after 100 days is that the President doesn't know where his own plane is

Well, that's not so bad, considering the Bush went through his whole Presidency without ever knowing where his brains were... ;)

[Mr. Oragahn]

But is there anything to do anymore now? He has his weapons, he's not willing to use them on people, but just making demos.

Yes, show openness and willingness to work with him, and perhaps convince him to be less of a prick with his people and respect human rights a bit more.

Yeah well it would be hard for Obama to start praising human rights considering the recent history of his country. He would certainly not be arguing from a stable posture.

And perhaps, in the long run, disarming his weapons...

Why should he do that? Are we disarming ours?

Yet that bullshit plan has been copied by pretty much every country around the world because they also thought it was the way to go.
Wonder why?
Perhaps it was because they all felt it was the only viable solution.
I'm no economist, but since the mojority of the Economic world thinks the proposal is the way to go, I guess I'm inclined to believe that, in the current situation, they're right.

They're telling shit, that's simple.
If most economists had a slightest clue about what they were doing, there would be no bubbles.
The real true plan was to barely save all these banks and put much more money into the country's structures, nationalize any faltering bank at low costs and reorganize them and reschedule their priorities and block some of their commercial activities, secure people's money in true depository banks that don't go gambing, and once and for all put the production of money in the hands of the government.

Anything else is a decoy to keep the flawed system in place.

And there's also something that needs to be realized by a lot of people:
We know the system needs to be changed, but this current system has been ingrained in our culture for so long, it is so big, and there will be so many people opposing any change (and powerful people at that), that any true, earth shattering change will take some time and a lot of efforts from everyone.

They don't seem to take much time to break regulations and pass earth shattering laws though. It's always the same excuses, it's going to be long, you don't realize, blah blah.

100 days?
Barely enough time to change anything.
Before you actually try to rebuild a bridge, first you have to make sure the bridge will still support your heavy equipment, and if you divert one lane to another while replacing it with a new one, the lane to which you divert traffic needs to be able to take it.

Let's make bets. At the end of Obama's mandate, he'll have done nothing to even trigger a true change of the system.
They're running for the lifeboats, trying to save the whole system for another turn.

Would the removal of such acts be accepted by everybody?

Well considering that "everybody" don't seem to know much about the Act and what it really does, and even how suspiciously fast it appeared, and then how it brutally passed actually, yeah, this is not going to change right now, and at best, people will point fingers at Bush, while Obama will be whiter than white (you already get a snipet of this with the release of memos... man this is just too farcical).

[Mr. Oragahn]

Can't wait for the poll that will be called "The Last 100 Days" btw! :)

[ILikeDeathNote]

Can't wait for the poll that will be called "The Last 100 Days" btw! :)

In 2016, right? ;)

[Praeothmin]

Yeah well it would be hard for Obama to start praising human rights considering the recent history of his country. He would certainly not be arguing from a stable posture.

The recent history has more to do with the "old" administration then with the country itself, so I don't see any issues with him praising human rights as a way to detach himself from the "older ways".
He never said he agreed with the old policies, after all (not that I know)...

Why should he do that? Are we disarming ours?

Didn't we disarm a shitload of "nucular" weapons a few years back?
Didn't the USSR?
Yes, we did...

If most economists had a slightest clue about what they were doing, there would be no bubbles.

Except, of course, if they, like everyone else in the world, had to follow the rules in place, in the systems in place.
'Cause, you know, being economists, they couldn't change the rules...
And also, I haven't heard many people complain of the rules when all was going well.
That's the problem with humans, they only complain about the system when they themselves (who cares about the neighbor) do not profit from it anymore...

It's always the same excuses, it's going to be long, you don't realize

Maybe it's because, you know, it's the truth...

[Mr. Oragahn]

The recent history has more to do with the "old" administration then with the country itself, so I don't see any issues with him praising human rights as a way to detach himself from the "older ways".
He never said he agreed with the old policies, after all (not that I know)...

Yeah well I don't really buy this manichean vision.

Didn't we disarm a shitload of "nucular" weapons a few years back?
Didn't the USSR?
Yes, we did...

And we still have a shit load of them, and when Israel threatened to nuke Iran at some point, no one said Tsahal was to be forbidden nuclear strike capacity.

If most economists had a slightest clue about what they were doing, there would be no bubbles.

Except, of course, if they, like everyone else in the world, had to follow the rules in place, in the systems in place.
'Cause, you know, being economists, they couldn't change the rules...

Put into place by... economists... waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The house of madness.

- You can't understand?!? These. Are. The. Rules!! We cannot ignore them!!!
- But why? They're rules after all, your people put them there. Just ditch the crap and the big blue book.
- WE CAN'T! IT'S TOO LATE!!! THE CORE IS OVERLOADING!!
- ....

And also, I haven't heard many people complain of the rules when all was going well.

Well, you probably noticed that by all going well, actually corresponded to massive amounts of money ending in the hands of the same, at the expense of super taxed populations, and at the sacrifice of the rest of the third world, which still lives in poor conditions and doesn't have a say about its territorial holdings and resources.
"All too well" is just a question of perspective, really.

That's the problem with humans, they only complain about the system when they themselves (who cares about the neighbor) do not profit from it anymore...

I suppose we could call that falling back into reality. Maybe it does take wisdom to refuse taking part in this system?

Maybe it's because, you know, it's the truth...

We heard the same excuses when Bush came in. Things were not going fast enough. It would take time, please wait.
Eight years later, it was excruciatingly too long.

[Mr. Oragahn]

Can't wait for the poll that will be called "The Last 100 Days" btw! :)

In 2016, right? ;)

It depends. If the country goes down the drain, there might be some of these heavily armed gun maniacs in the US, possibly white supremacists, wanting to send a bullet through some certain skull.
You never know.