Have the Protocol Droid's mind wiped.

Mike DiCenso · Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Wed Feb 27, 2008 1:03 am

Sorry, that was a typo on my part. It should have read "others". I've since corrected that.
-Mike

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:25 am

Cpl Kendal wrote:if your vehicle diagnostic machine told you that your wife was cheating on you, would you believe it?

If that thing could fly, make decisions on its own, show greater intelligence than most of my neighbors, hack through any computer with enough time, plot complex hyperspace jumps, understand enough human emotions to know when to keep a secret?

I sure would be dumb not to... :)

mojo · Post by **mojo** » Wed Feb 27, 2008 6:22 am

Once again I agree with Praeothmin. I absolutely would at least look into the validity of any statement R2 made, in that position.
Thank you for all your comments. The only thing that made any sense to me as a possible reason for R2 not telling Luke about Vader was the idea that he had been ordered not to. I have major problems with even this idea, however, since after Obi-Wan died R2 seemed to me to be under the impression that Luke was his master, and it seems like any order he was given beforehand would be nullified by that. Is there any way of forcing a droid not to mention something in Star Wars? I'm pretty sure I never saw anything like that in the movie, so what about in the EU? Alternatively, is there any logical reason for R2 to decide on his own not to bring this up? Someone mentioned the same reasons Obi-Wan had. Aside from the fact that he had no idea Vader was Luke's father in their original talk, what were those reasons? Even though tESB is my favorite of the Star Wars movies, this has somehow slipped my mind. Possibly because I didn't buy it.

Speaking of the Thrawn novels, I LOVED them. I just recently finished them, and being desperate for more I just bought the book 'Specter of the Past', which looked like a sequel to me. Can anyone tell me whether this is any good, and (I know I'm asking a lot here, so ignore this if you feel like it of course) possibly recommend other EU books that someone who just adored the Thrawn trilogy might like?

mojo · Post by **mojo** » Wed Feb 27, 2008 6:24 am

Reading through that post I realized I asked for about twenty different things there. I apologize for that, and I want to thank you all again for your attention. I really do appreciate it, since I know this isn't the normal kind of question this forum debates.

Mike DiCenso · Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:05 pm

Then there is the rather sticky ethical/moral issue with casually wiping out the mind of what is supposedly a truely sentient being...
-Mike

CrippledVulture · Post by **CrippledVulture** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:28 am

It doesn't make sense for threepio to have some unique or at even rare understanding of artoo's language. Astromech droids are too useful and (in the rebel and republic fleets at least) ubiquitous. Half the rebel fighter fleet is equipped with them.

That said, it doesn't make sense for these extremely useful droids to speak anything other than basic...

Mike DiCenso · Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:22 am

Another good point. Why do the astromech droids only "speak" in the chips, beeps, and whistles, when they could just as easily be made to speak in basic like any protocol droid?
-Mike

mojo · Post by **mojo** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 6:27 am

Because it's cute for R2 to go 'BLEEP BLEEP BLOOOOOOOOOP!' as he falls headlong into a pile of debris.

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:52 pm

Praeothmin wrote:
If that thing could fly, make decisions on its own, show greater intelligence than most of my neighbors, hack through any computer with enough time, plot complex hyperspace jumps, understand enough human emotions to know when to keep a secret?

I sure would be dumb not to... :)

In SW, droids while obviously intelligent are treated as tools. Even Luke had this attitude to some extent. Throw in the common practice of mind-wipes on them, I would imagine most people wouldn't put a lot of stock in a droids ramblings. Look at Solo and C-3PO.

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:54 pm

Mike DiCenso wrote:Another good point. Why do the astromech droids only "speak" in the chips, beeps, and whistles, when they could just as easily be made to speak in basic like any protocol droid?
-Mike

I got the impression (maybe I saw it somewhere) that astromech droids are not expected to deal with people on a regular basis. And when they do (like in an X-Wing) they have a screen.

Edit: Might also be economic, cheaper to install the support for a two-tone speaker than a full blown system ala a translator droid. Similiar to how the Stromtroopers are equiped with less effective armor than they could be because a crapload of that armour is cheaper than awesome armour.

And no this is not an invitation to discuss the quality of Stormtrooper armour or troop numbers.

Mike DiCenso · Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 8:21 pm

I might have agreed with you, Kendall, however, the Trade Federation, later Seperatist droids are highly mass manufactured, yet they all seem to have vocal speech, though not of the relative high quality of Threepio.

So why not do the same for the astromech series?
-Mike

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:00 pm

Mike DiCenso wrote:I might have agreed with you, Kendall, however, the Trade Federation, later Seperatist droids are highly mass manufactured, yet they all seem to have vocal speech, though not of the relative high quality of Threepio.

So why not do the same for the astromech series?
-Mike

I would imagine because droid troops would be expected to interact with humans/aliens on a regular basis.

Mike DiCenso · Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:20 am

Except that it seems that astromechs interact with humans/aliens on a fairly regular basis, and an X-wing or other starfighter pilot should not have to always be looking down at the dash board to see what his R2 unit is trying to tell him.
-Mike

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:22 am

Cpl Kendall wrote:In SW, droids while obviously intelligent are treated as tools. Even Luke had this attitude to some extent. Throw in the common practice of mind-wipes on them, I would imagine most people wouldn't put a lot of stock in a droids ramblings. Look at Solo and C-3PO.

Then why wipe the mind of C3P0?
If people didn't put a lot of stock in droid's ramblings, as you say, then why have 3P0's mind wiped?
It's not like people would listen to him then, would they?

I see no logic in wiping the mind of 3P0 and not that of Artoo.
You either do both, or none at all.
They probably kept Artoo's mind untouched so that Lucas could do one part of the continuity right:
Artoo remembering he once belonged to Obi-Wan... :)

mojo · Post by **mojo** » Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:50 am

Praeothmin wrote:
Cpl Kendall wrote:In SW, droids while obviously intelligent are treated as tools. Even Luke had this attitude to some extent. Throw in the common practice of mind-wipes on them, I would imagine most people wouldn't put a lot of stock in a droids ramblings. Look at Solo and C-3PO.
Then why wipe the mind of C3P0?
If people didn't put a lot of stock in droid's ramblings, as you say, then why have 3P0's mind wiped?
It's not like people would listen to him then, would they?

I see no logic in wiping the mind of 3P0 and not that of Artoo.
You either do both, or none at all.
They probably kept Artoo's mind untouched so that Lucas could do one part of the continuity right:
Artoo remembering he once belonged to Obi-Wan... :)

I forgot about that. I assumed he thought he belonged to Obi-Wan because Leia sent him to him with that message. That does make sense, but doesn't solve the other problems.