Starfleet Jedi

Easier to think that it's the crystal manufacturer who fucked up. They probably had a whole stock of crap crystals that they couldn't make pure or clear enough without polishing them down to such a size that they wouldn't be fit for the weapons' needs, so they were sold at the proper caliber, but had all sorts of crap on their surface.
Tell me that kind of shit doesn't happen on Earth.

Contrary to what is thought by some, the "rebels" using those imperial blasters in ANH didn't have such greater hit/miss ratios than the stormtroopers themselves. Plus the Rebels were meant to be taken alive, or let flee for the beacon on the Millennium Falcon to lead the Empire to the rebel base.

Mr. Oragahn wrote:Easier to think that it's the crystal manufacturer who fucked up. They probably had a whole stock of crap crystals that they couldn't make pure or clear enough without polishing them down to such a size that they wouldn't be fit for the weapons' needs, so they were sold at the proper caliber, but had all sorts of crap on their surface.
Tell me that kind of shit doesn't happen on Earth.

Contrary to what is thought by some, the "rebels" using those imperial blasters in ANH didn't have such greater hit/miss ratios than the stormtroopers themselves. Plus the Rebels were meant to be taken alive, or let flee for the beacon on the Millennium Falcon to lead the Empire to the rebel base.

Then how could stormtroopers be "so precise" in hitting the Jawa's transport?
The hit-miss ratio is just what happens in a firefight, vs. targeting an unarmed target that isn't shooting back.
Note when the stormtroopers try to stop Han at Mos Eisley, the first thing he does is start shooting the WALLS-- clearly he wasn't trying to hurt them, so much as get them to take cover and create a lot of flying debris while he made his getaway.

Mr. Oragahn wrote:Easier to think that it's the crystal manufacturer who fucked up. They probably had a whole stock of crap crystals that they couldn't make pure or clear enough without polishing them down to such a size that they wouldn't be fit for the weapons' needs, so they were sold at the proper caliber, but had all sorts of crap on their surface.
Tell me that kind of shit doesn't happen on Earth.

Contrary to what is thought by some, the "rebels" using those imperial blasters in ANH didn't have such greater hit/miss ratios than the stormtroopers themselves. Plus the Rebels were meant to be taken alive, or let flee for the beacon on the Millennium Falcon to lead the Empire to the rebel base.

MauriceWindows wrote: Then how could stormtroopers be "so precise" in hitting the Jawa's transport?
The hit-miss ratio is just what happens in a firefight, vs. targeting an unarmed target that isn't shooting back.
Note when the stormtroopers try to stop Han at Mos Eisley, the first thing he does is start shooting the WALLS-- clearly he wasn't trying to hurt them, so much as get them to take cover and create a lot of flying debris while he made his getaway.

Obi-Won likes to make dry and sarcastic jokes. Sand people use slug throwers after all, and are shown to be able to hit speeding pod racers after all.

Blasters are often like smooth bore muskets and pistols.

MauriceWindows wrote: Then how could stormtroopers be "so precise" in hitting the Jawa's transport?

Nonsensical character statement entirely bollox'd by the creator in another movie?

As Lucky said, Tusken raiders are very good, and the speed of their projectiles even forces them to largely guess the position of their target.
Stormtroopers... on the other hand, I don't see what makes those impacts anything particularly impressive.
The reality is that the Tusken don't have any weaponry that could have damaged the Jawa sandcrawler to that extent. Point? Everybody assumed Obi-Wan talked about the rifles, when he spoke of heavy weapons, which the Tusken would probably suck at.

Lucky wrote:

Mr. Oragahn wrote:Easier to think that it's the crystal manufacturer who fucked up. They probably had a whole stock of crap crystals that they couldn't make pure or clear enough without polishing them down to such a size that they wouldn't be fit for the weapons' needs, so they were sold at the proper caliber, but had all sorts of crap on their surface.
Tell me that kind of shit doesn't happen on Earth.

Contrary to what is thought by some, the "rebels" using those imperial blasters in ANH didn't have such greater hit/miss ratios than the stormtroopers themselves. Plus the Rebels were meant to be taken alive, or let flee for the beacon on the Millennium Falcon to lead the Empire to the rebel base.

MauriceWindows wrote: Then how could stormtroopers be "so precise" in hitting the Jawa's transport?
The hit-miss ratio is just what happens in a firefight, vs. targeting an unarmed target that isn't shooting back.
Note when the stormtroopers try to stop Han at Mos Eisley, the first thing he does is start shooting the WALLS-- clearly he wasn't trying to hurt them, so much as get them to take cover and create a lot of flying debris while he made his getaway.

Obi-Won likes to make dry and sarcastic jokes. Sand people use slug throwers after all, and are shown to be able to hit speeding pod racers after all.

Blasters are often like smooth bore muskets and pistols.

He was making the point that it WASN'T Sand people that did it.
Again, you're confusing a firefight with a staged attack against an unarmed target.

MauriceWindows wrote:

Lucky wrote:

Mr. Oragahn wrote:Easier to think that it's the crystal manufacturer who fucked up. They probably had a whole stock of crap crystals that they couldn't make pure or clear enough without polishing them down to such a size that they wouldn't be fit for the weapons' needs, so they were sold at the proper caliber, but had all sorts of crap on their surface.
Tell me that kind of shit doesn't happen on Earth.

Contrary to what is thought by some, the "rebels" using those imperial blasters in ANH didn't have such greater hit/miss ratios than the stormtroopers themselves. Plus the Rebels were meant to be taken alive, or let flee for the beacon on the Millennium Falcon to lead the Empire to the rebel base.

MauriceWindows wrote: Then how could stormtroopers be "so precise" in hitting the Jawa's transport?
The hit-miss ratio is just what happens in a firefight, vs. targeting an unarmed target that isn't shooting back.
Note when the stormtroopers try to stop Han at Mos Eisley, the first thing he does is start shooting the WALLS-- clearly he wasn't trying to hurt them, so much as get them to take cover and create a lot of flying debris while he made his getaway.

Obi-Won likes to make dry and sarcastic jokes. Sand people use slug throwers after all, and are shown to be able to hit speeding pod racers after all.

Blasters are often like smooth bore muskets and pistols.

He was making the point that it WASN'T Sand people that did it.
Again, you're confusing a firefight with a staged attack against an unarmed target.

Your point? It's commonly argued that the quote in question is evidence of Storm Troopers actually be able to hit the board side of a barn, and everything on screen is a fluke..

Lucky wrote: Your point? It's commonly argued that the quote in question is evidence of Storm Troopers actually be able to hit the board side of a barn, and everything on screen is a fluke..

That makes no sense. The quote can ONLY mean that they're more precise than Sand-people--incomparably more precise.

Most people don't know this, but the Stormtroopers on the Death Star were ordered from SQUARE ONE to allow the rebels to rescue Leah and escape; this creates the first impression that they're suck-shots, if an entire prison-cell full of them can get killed, and Luke & Friends didn't get a scratch.
But here's a quote from the novel:

voice reported over an unseen speaker. "Sirs, we've captured a small freighter that was entering the remains of Alderaan. A standard check indicates that its markings apparently match that of the ship which blasted its way out of the quarantine at Mos Eisley, Tatooine system, and went hyper before the Imperial blockade craft there could close on it."
Tarkin looked puzzled. "Mos Eisley? Tatooine? What is this? What's this all about, Vader?"
"It means, Tarkin, that the last of our unresolved difficulties is about to be eliminated. Someone apparently received the missing data tapes, learned who transcribed them, and was trying to return them to her. We may be able to facilitate their meeting with the Senator."
Tarkin started to say something, hesitated, then nodded in understanding. "How convenient. I leave this matter in your hands, Vader."

Soit's not like Vader and Tarkin allowed the escape sometime after the prison-break; it was their plan from the moment they captured the Falcon.
Basically the Stormtroopers could have killed or captured them at any time, but they had orders not to, from the beginning-- but not to make it look too easy, either.

Since most people don't know this, they see the Stormtroopers unable to hit three people and a Wookie, and conclude that they're hopeless bumblers.

It was Endor that damaged Stormtrooper's reputation as much as Death Star, but even there they have excuse (ambushed, etc).

Picard wrote:It was Endor that damaged Stormtrooper's reputation as much as Death Star, but even there they have excuse (ambushed, etc).

Two words: Tet Offensive.

MauriceWindows wrote:

Lucky wrote: Your point? It's commonly argued that the quote in question is evidence of Storm Troopers actually be able to hit the board side of a barn, and everything on screen is a fluke..

That makes no sense. The quote can ONLY mean that they're more precise than Sand-people--incomparably more precise.

Most people don't know this, but the Stormtroopers on the Death Star were ordered from SQUARE ONE to allow the rebels to rescue Leah and escape; this creates the first impression that they're suck-shots, if an entire prison-cell full of them can get killed, and Luke & Friends didn't get a scratch.
But here's a quote from the novel:

voice reported over an unseen speaker. "Sirs, we've captured a small freighter that was entering the remains of Alderaan. A standard check indicates that its markings apparently match that of the ship which blasted its way out of the quarantine at Mos Eisley, Tatooine system, and went hyper before the Imperial blockade craft there could close on it."
Tarkin looked puzzled. "Mos Eisley? Tatooine? What is this? What's this all about, Vader?"
"It means, Tarkin, that the last of our unresolved difficulties is about to be eliminated. Someone apparently received the missing data tapes, learned who transcribed them, and was trying to return them to her. We may be able to facilitate their meeting with the Senator."
Tarkin started to say something, hesitated, then nodded in understanding. "How convenient. I leave this matter in your hands, Vader."

Soit's not like Vader and Tarkin allowed the escape sometime after the prison-break; it was their plan from the moment they captured the Falcon.
Basically the Stormtroopers could have killed or captured them at any time, but they had orders not to, from the beginning-- but not to make it look too easy, either.

Since most people don't know this, they see the Stormtroopers unable to hit three people and a Wookie, and conclude that they're hopeless bumblers.

That's good, but what about the stormies shooting at Han in Mos Eisley ?

This thread's gonna need some splitting very soon, methinks.

Mr. Oragahn wrote: That's good, but what about the stormies shooting at Han in Mos Eisley ?

Han was shooting back and they were running for cover.

MauriceWindows wrote:

Mr. Oragahn wrote: That's good, but what about the stormies shooting at Han in Mos Eisley ?

Han was shooting back and they were running for cover.

I'm not asking what Han was doing, but asking about the nature of the stormtroopers' shots, their role and efficiency.

Lucky wrote: Your point? It's commonly argued that the quote in question is evidence of Storm Troopers actually be able to hit the board side of a barn, and everything on screen is a fluke..

MauriceWindows wrote: That makes no sense. The quote can ONLY mean that they're more precise than Sand-people--incomparably more precise.

Sadly I don't have the movie to check, but I seem to recall Obi Won saying only Storm Troopers are that precise, implying Storm Troopers have unusually good aim, or he was making a sarcastic comment.

MauriceWindows wrote:Most people don't know this, but the Stormtroopers on the Death Star were ordered from SQUARE ONE to allow the rebels to rescue Leah and escape; this creates the first impression that they're suck-shots, if an entire prison-cell full of them can get killed, and Luke & Friends didn't get a scratch.
But here's a quote from the novel:

voice reported over an unseen speaker. "Sirs, we've captured a small freighter that was entering the remains of Alderaan. A standard check indicates that its markings apparently match that of the ship which blasted its way out of the quarantine at Mos Eisley, Tatooine system, and went hyper before the Imperial blockade craft there could close on it."
Tarkin looked puzzled. "Mos Eisley? Tatooine? What is this? What's this all about, Vader?"
"It means, Tarkin, that the last of our unresolved difficulties is about to be eliminated. Someone apparently received the missing data tapes, learned who transcribed them, and was trying to return them to her. We may be able to facilitate their meeting with the Senator."
Tarkin started to say something, hesitated, then nodded in understanding. "How convenient. I leave this matter in your hands, Vader."

Soit's not like Vader and Tarkin allowed the escape sometime after the prison-break; it was their plan from the moment they captured the Falcon.
Basically the Stormtroopers could have killed or captured them at any time, but they had orders not to, from the beginning-- but not to make it look too easy, either.

Since most people don't know this, they see the Stormtroopers unable to hit three people and a Wookie, and conclude that they're hopeless bumblers.

Which doesn't matter when they miss just as badly every other time they are in fact going for a kill in every other battle.

Obi-Wan in ANH does say:
"Only Stormtroopers are that precise."

Taken in context, where they were investigating an attack on the Jawas by an unknown force, Obi-Wan's comment clearly meant that they did not need to try an look for answers for long.
Only Stormtroopers, out of all the warriors Obi-Wan knew off, were so precise, in that they were more precise than the Tusken Raiders...

And Lucky's right, it doesn't make them better when facing unamed mooks, like the Rebels on the Tantive IV, the Rebels on Hoth in TESB, or the Ewoks in RotJ...

My 2c.

I'm gonna contact Mike so he may split this thread, it's largely way off topic by now.