Starfleet Jedi

Piet is in command of the SSD the events of the battle of Endor play out about the same only mid way in the battle the above mentioned borg fleet appear in the middle of the Battle and began attacking imperial ships with the intent to infest and take over..them before turning their attentions to the Rebellion

Borg goal: preventing the Rebel forces from destroying the deathstar Assimilate it after Sidious death and and the opposing fleets and convert the DS 11 into a mobile fortress for assimilation of the SWU

Borg numbers are: 6 Cubes 2 Tactical Cubes and 10 spheres

can they succeed?

The borg fail miserably.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJZbCNexctc

2 misses at 16 seconds
another at 17 seconds
another at 18 seconds
another at 19 seconds
finally hits at 20 seconds
miss at 21 seconds
hit at 21 seconds

6/8 misses. A 25% hit rate, against Federation starships.

The Rebel X wings, A wings and such that will be trying to get to the Death Star 2 and destroy it are far, far, far smaller than the Federation starships that the borg cube had a 25% chance of hitting. They're also far faster; high end calculations for even the smaller Federation craft based on moving across the side of the borg cube is about 1 km/sec, impressive, but Star Wars starfighters have been shown to go at speeds of over 100 km/sec, sometimes speeds of several hundred kms/sec.

Also, the video shows other things:

1. The effective range of borg cube and Federation ships are about 1 km.
2. Federation ships are impressive in their speed and maneuverability.
3. The borg cube cannot seem to be able to fire at more than one target at a time.

This means that the borg fleet really won't be a help, a help. Lando suggested attacking the star destroyers at point blank range, presumably to use them as meatshields so that the superlaser doesn't vape them. However, said point blank range was dozens of kilometers; likely outside of the typical effective range for borg cubes. 6 borg cubes couldn't possibly cover the 900 km; or 160 km, depending on the source, Death Star 2 without:

1. Only covering the very center of the Death Star 2, which would allow starfighters to simply fly around them.
2. Spreading themselves out across the entire diameters, which would involve tens of hundreds of kms of space between the borg cube. As this is beyond their effective range, the Rebel fleet could simply go in between them and ignore the borg cubes.

Therefore, the borg cubes lack the range, accuracy, weapon spread or, although not mentioned, firepower to take out the Rebel starfighters.

The second part of the plan, to assimilate the Death Star 2, is so ridiculously laughable and suicidal that they'd have practically no chance of succeeding. The Death Star 2 can, at any moment, simply blow up the entire borg fleet with its superlaser.

If anything, this helps the Rebels. Or not that much, since the imperials would not be distracted for that long. The borg would open with their typical resistance is futile speech, then the imperial vessel one shot the borg cubes, and then the battle continues.

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJZbCNexctc

2 misses at 16 seconds
another at 17 seconds
another at 18 seconds
another at 19 seconds
finally hits at 20 seconds
miss at 21 seconds
hit at 21 seconds

6/8 misses. A 25% hit rate, against Federation starships.

I don't think the Borg cube is missing all of its shots. It looks like it is just aiming at other ships currently off screen.


Besides which, a single cube can take on an entire fleet, and yes, even a fleet a Star Destroyers, due to their very large size. Star Destroyers and the myraid rebel battle ships may be more durable than their Federation counterparts, but they would have a difficult time taking out a single cube, let alone a fleet of them. The only real weapon they have is the Death Star, but the damned thing is much too big and vulnerable. It's only weapon, the Superlaser, can easily be evaded. And I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be too much of a feat to just simply shoot a few precision guided torpedoes, or sent a smaller Borg ship to infiltrate it and shut it down.

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]

oh sure they only lul stomped an entire fleet of vessels where the even the smallest participating enemy was capable of blasting a planet into a dead hunk of space rock...

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJZbCNexctc

2 misses at 16 seconds
another at 17 seconds
another at 18 seconds
another at 19 seconds
finally hits at 20 seconds
miss at 21 seconds
hit at 21 seconds

oh look better range and accuracy then star wars..and superior tanking power to boot

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]]The Rebel X wings, A wings and such that will be trying to get to the Death Star 2 and destroy it are far, far, far smaller than the Federation starships that the borg cube had a 25% chance of hitting.

the borg can just ram them...or sweep them out of the stars with a tractor beam

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]They're also far faster; high end calculations for even the smaller Federation craft based on moving across the side of the borg cube is about 1 km/sec, impressive, but Star Wars starfighters have been shown to go at speeds of over 100 km/sec, sometimes speeds of several hundred kms/sec.

if those calcs came from space battles or SDN don't use them in my thread

Also, the video shows other things:

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]]1. The effective range of borg cube and Federation ships are about 1 km.

I didn't realize a ship slowly moving along swatting away flies was an objective reading on their range

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]2. Federation ships are impressive in their speed and maneuverability.

this might be the first time you've said anything decent and honest about trek..cool

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]3. The borg cube cannot seem to be able to fire at more than one target at a time.

it didn't need too in that instance..

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]This means that the borg fleet really won't be a help, a help. Lando suggested attacking the star destroyers at point blank range, presumably to use them as meatshields so that the superlaser doesn't vape them. However, said point blank range was dozens of kilometers; likely outside of the typical effective range for borg cubes. 6 borg cubes couldn't possibly cover the 900 km; or 160 km, depending on the source, Death Star 2 without:

you really have no basis to make this claim..

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]1. Only covering the very center of the Death Star 2, which would allow starfighters to simply fly around them.

they want the Ds they also want the SSD and the ISD's it wont be the only target out there

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]
2. Spreading themselves out across the entire diameters, which would involve tens of hundreds of kms of space between the borg cube. As this is beyond their effective range, the Rebel fleet could simply go in between them and ignore the borg cubes.

ignoring vessels actively out to rape you and your enemy..isn't entirely smart Ackbar may of been cautious and timid but he wasn't an idiot

Therefore, the borg cubes lack the range, accuracy, weapon spread or, although not mentioned, firepower to take out the Rebel starfighters.

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]The second part of the plan, to assimilate the Death Star 2, is so ridiculously laughable and suicidal that they'd have practically no chance of succeeding.

well that's interesting since the borg where able to infiltrate and take over alien style a ship with far superior bio scanners..and did so with out being detected..on a gargantuan space station..there is plenty of places to hide and fodder to grab a hold of..never mind that Borg have shown the ability iirc to infect computer systems...and begin upgrading/assimilating

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]] The Death Star 2 can, at any moment, simply blow up the entire borg fleet with its superlaser.

no it can't no single ship it targeted showed the speed of trek ships

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:The borg fail miserably.]If anything, this helps the Rebels. Or not that much, since the imperials would not be distracted for that long. The borg would open with their typical resistance is futile speech, then the imperial vessel one shot the borg cubes, and then the battle continues.

bull pwap complete and utter BS

ROFL what; is this your strategy, admiral? Trying to use 3 km by 3 km by 3 km cubes to ram small starfighters? What tactical idiocy is this? In fact, using ramming tactics as a regular tactic at all is idiotic in space, because it's using ancient naval tactics in a sci fi setting.

And "you have no basis for this claim" what? And claims that the borg cube is actually maneuverable?

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:ROFL what; is this your strategy, admiral? Trying to use 3 km by 3 km by 3 km cubes to ram small starfighters? What tactical idiocy is this? In fact, using ramming tactics as a regular tactic at all is idiotic in space, because it's using ancient naval tactics in a sci fi setting. ]

it was "at worse they can just move forward and go through them with out the fighters being able to run away or do anything but get run over" type comment I just didn't feel like wasting the energy required to type that length up..for such a response

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:And "you have no basis for this claim" what? And claims that the borg cube is actually maneuverable?

they chased the Enterprise over took them did rather well for gigantic block sized death machines against the wannabe first ones..and have shown considerable speed when needed..theres no suggesting they can't just zip around blasting down shields crippling ships and transporting their way into the enemy fleet to begin assimilation

Admiral Breetai wrote: they chased the Enterprise over took them did rather well for gigantic block sized death machines against the wannabe first ones..and have shown considerable speed when needed..theres no suggesting they can't just zip around blasting down shields crippling ships and transporting their way into the enemy fleet to begin assimilation

Aren't Borg cubes faster than Federation ships in general? At the very least, I recall that they are much better able to maintain high speeds without burning out their engines; such was the case in their many encounters with the Enterprise-D...

JCP wrote: Aren't Borg cubes faster than Federation ships in general? At the very least, I recall that they are much better able to maintain high speeds without burning out their engines; such was the case in their many encounters with the Enterprise-D...

ehh fed cap ships tend to move like fighters Borg Don't do that but they are still pretty fast for their size and shape faster then most big sci fi cap ships in the mid tier

The borg fail miserably.]They're also far faster; high end calculations for even the smaller Federation craft based on moving across the side of the borg cube is about 1 km/sec, impressive, but Star Wars starfighters have been shown to go at speeds of over 100 km/sec, sometimes speeds of several hundred kms/sec.

SW fighters (X-WINGS) took over 3 minutes at "FULL THROTTLE" (as per lukes instructions to keep the fighters off them) to get down the trench in ANH....

In fact all combat speeds for fighters seen in SW have been embarrassingly slow.

JCP wrote:

Admiral Breetai wrote: they chased the Enterprise over took them did rather well for gigantic block sized death machines against the wannabe first ones..and have shown considerable speed when needed..theres no suggesting they can't just zip around blasting down shields crippling ships and transporting their way into the enemy fleet to begin assimilation

Aren't Borg cubes faster than Federation ships in general? At the very least, I recall that they are much better able to maintain high speeds without burning out their engines; such was the case in their many encounters with the Enterprise-D...

That is correct.

Hhmmm, I tend to agree with SWST, that the Borg fail miserably, though not at all for the reasons he mentioned.
While the Borg will rape any and every ship that come their way, if the fighters choose to ignore the Borg, just like in RotJ, and go for the DS instead, since the Borg do not know of the Rebel's plans, while they may destroy and assimilate Rebel and Imperial ships alike without too much problems, the fighters and MF will still be able to make the DS run, and the DS will still blow up, probably killing all the Borg that beamed aboard to start assimilation...
Or the Borg will simply ignore both fleets, and aim right for the DS II's power core, in which the Hypermatter closely resembles the Omega particle in energy and power (simple fan conjecture) and ignore Rebels and Imperials alike...
Oh, and the DS II can and probably will destroy any Borg cube in one shot, and the Borg are not in the habit of evading, as they did not evade Species' 8472's biobeams which were capable of ripping through Borg ships easily...

Hypermatter and Omega being related? Shades of TFC are still in you, Praeothmin.

Anyway, that disagrees with what Wookiepedia says hypermatter is, claiming that it's "tachyonic matter". Tachyons.

Khas wrote:Hypermatter and Omega being related? Shades of TFC are still in you, Praeothmin.

Anyway, that disagrees with what Wookiepedia says hypermatter is, claiming that it's "tachyonic matter". Tachyons.

And who says Omega particles are not "tachyonic"?

Star Trek. :)

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Tachyon

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Omega_molecule

Bah, humbug... :)

This still doesn't mean that the super energetic 200GT inducing Hypermatter would not pique the Borg's curiosity... :)