Starfleet Jedi

How can anyone say is no holes star war shields? When one man fighter was able to fly right thought the First Death Star defector shields. I am not say most star wars starship defector shields are that bad but I am saying that they do have some smell holes in them.

Truly one of a kind, I think this deflector shield was largely about deflecting massive drifting objects and other particles the old fashioned way, by applying a fixed force over a given distance, since a fighter could push through it.
That's different from the DSII's shield, which was an impermeable skin, which some Rebel fighters crashed upon after failing to detect its presence.

I guess the DSI largely counted on its armour, sheer mass and countless cannons to deal with any enemy fleet (the EU is quite clear on that).
The shield might also have had the ability to dissipate energy weapons.

What we can observe is that the force field had a thickness with a considerable gap between itself and the station's surface.

Well, there are the two cases in the prequel movies where a fighter flies straight through what should be a shielded zone.

(Anakin flies into two hangars while shields are up. I find it curious that he is able to do so. If SW carriers leave their hangers open to enemy fire, you'd just shoot straight through)

More likely, however, is that the difference between ray and particle shielding has something to do with it.

Roondar wrote:Well, there are the two cases in the prequel movies where a fighter flies straight through what should be a shielded zone.

(Anakin flies into two hangars while shields are up. I find it curious that he is able to do so. If SW carriers leave their hangers open to enemy fire, you'd just shoot straight through)

More likely, however, is that the difference between ray and particle shielding has something to do with it.

If you watch closely, as Anakin's N-1 enters the hangars, a squadron of droid vultures leave.
It's the Force.

Mr. Oragahn wrote:

Roondar wrote:Well, there are the two cases in the prequel movies where a fighter flies straight through what should be a shielded zone.

(Anakin flies into two hangars while shields are up. I find it curious that he is able to do so. If SW carriers leave their hangers open to enemy fire, you'd just shoot straight through)

More likely, however, is that the difference between ray and particle shielding has something to do with it.

If you watch closely, as Anakin's N-1 enters the hangars, a squadron of droid vultures leave.
It's the Force.

Ok, that's the one in the first movie.

But what about the second one (where Anakin and Obi-wan fly into the big ship they later crash land on Corruscant)?

Roondar wrote:

Mr. Oragahn wrote:

Roondar wrote:Well, there are the two cases in the prequel movies where a fighter flies straight through what should be a shielded zone.

(Anakin flies into two hangars while shields are up. I find it curious that he is able to do so. If SW carriers leave their hangers open to enemy fire, you'd just shoot straight through)

More likely, however, is that the difference between ray and particle shielding has something to do with it.

If you watch closely, as Anakin's N-1 enters the hangars, a squadron of droid vultures leave.
It's the Force.

Ok, that's the one in the first movie.

But what about the second one (where Anakin and Obi-wan fly into the big ship they later crash land on Corruscant)?

The main shields were largely gone (although the novel implies that they were flickering or something). That explains how Anakin had the possibility to shoot the device on the hull.
That thing controlled the hangar's shield, which was cut off. I don't think any shield was left when both Obi-Wan and Anakin arrived.

Sorry, but that's a load of crap.

In every battle in the movies fighters get through the shields. In Return of the Jedi there are multiple instances of fighters damaging star destroyers. In Ep I Annie flies through the the docking bay. In Ep III, Annie destroys an unprotected shield generator to gain access to the docking bay. And the very example in the original post states that the fighters flew right to the death star's surface.

The Star Wars movies have yet to show capital ships will shields the encompass the entire surface of the ship. There's far more evidence that shows that such shields don't exist.

The idea that the shields were already down from some other means, is silly. At best star wars capital ship shields are useless because of all the times where they are shown as ineffective.

Sunburst wrote:Sorry, but that's a load of crap.

In every battle in the movies fighters get through the shields. In Return of the Jedi there are multiple instances of fighters damaging star destroyers.

Either the shield as a whole, or just an arc, was down, or only energy shields had been switched on, and thus concussion missiles proved useful.

In Ep I Annie flies through the the docking bay. In Ep III, Annie destroys an unprotected shield generator to gain access to the docking bay.

See above.
I must say I don't really see what's crap in that, nor what you're really trying to prove.

And the very example in the original post states that the fighters flew right to the death star's surface.

The Star Wars movies have yet to show capital ships will shields the encompass the entire surface of the ship. There's far more evidence that shows that such shields don't exist.

Simple: Trade Federation Droid Control ship. The shields offered no target of opportunity for the Naboo fighters and their torpedoes.
Even the big dish, which I thought had been destroyed for ages, was actually there after the big fireball sequence.

The EU and the CWS are all agreeing with full shield coverage.

Other movie case: the second Death Star, which needed a grounded shield emitter at that time, because it didn't have its own new defense system. The shield allowed no entry, and protected the entirety of the battle station and a large area around the shield emitter.

Hell, even when Anakin activates the shield on his fighter, we see the entire craft being sheathed in a fizzling skin that quickly vanishes.

Droidekas, although not ships, can be fully protected by their bubble shields.

In ROTS, we see Trade Federation battleships hit by Republican fire, and the energy dissipates as blue ripples over the hull, proving the existence of a different type of shield. The logical mind would understand that any republican warship would shoot at the unshielded part, if it ever existed.
This didn't happen, though.

The idea that the shields were already down from some other means, is silly. At best star wars capital ship shields are useless because of all the times where they are shown as ineffective.

They are effective.

You have to do better than the shield was already down on the capital ship.

This isn't star trek where there shields are shown to cover the entire area of the ship. There has never been an instance in the films where an entire capital ship has been shown to be fully protected by shields emanating from the ship itself.

The Naboo fighter appeared fully shielded, and if it was than that is the largest thing in star wars shown to be fully shielded.

Episode I showed that the control ship had holes in the shield that fighters could fly through.
Ep III, well, you're acting obtuse, (not that you are) so there's no point in continuing that line of thought
Jedi, A-wings destroyed the shield generators with their laser cannons, and don't even come back with any crazy ideas from any recent books saying otherwise. That's the logical progression in the film. They're destroyed, then the shields are down. They've been shield generators since 1983. If you don't like it lump it. If you bring up the EU, well, they've been shield generators in the EU at least since Rebel Assault.


We also know that tech does not necessarily scale in the Wars verse. So scaling up shield from the fighters to the capital ships aren't a logical progression. (lightsabers are a hand held weapon only, there's no large scale equivalent, just like the superlaser has no smaller scale planet busting model [granted the gunships have combining laser cannon attributes])

Capital ships have holes in their shields, anyone that says differently is going to have to prove it with something other than the EU alternate universe say so.

ROTJ is interesting because the DS-II is so obviously shielded from fighters.
Doubly so because we never see fighters bother with shields against cap-ships. They can get awfully close without hitting any shield anyway.

But you are right about the prequels.

Sunburst wrote:You have to do better than the shield was already down on the capital ship.

This isn't star trek where there shields are shown to cover the entire area of the ship. There has never been an instance in the films where an entire capital ship has been shown to be fully protected by shields emanating from the ship itself.

Sure, since shields are invisible. Even when hit, they don't flare up like in Trek or Stargate.

The Naboo fighter appeared fully shielded, and if it was than that is the largest thing in star wars shown to be fully shielded.

Because it's the only thing in Star Wars that's been seen to activate shields, and they still were Naboo/Nubian made shields. Once up, they didn't act any differently than any other ship, shield or else.
Without going into the EU or some reference from the CGI show, in the movies we know a bridge can have its own shield, we know that a small cargo ship has shield arcs, at least frontal and rear.

Episode I showed that the control ship had holes in the shield that fighters could fly through.

See above.

Ep III, well, you're acting obtuse, (not that you are) so there's no point in continuing that line of thought

Huh. The novel has some references about the IH's shields if you want to know. They're available on Guardian's website.

Jedi, A-wings destroyed the shield generators with their laser cannons, and don't even come back with any crazy ideas from any recent books saying otherwise.

They were concussion missiles, and yes, I believe they went through the shields used then.

That's the logical progression in the film. They're destroyed, then the shields are down. They've been shield generators since 1983. If you don't like it lump it. If you bring up the EU, well, they've been shield generators in the EU at least since Rebel Assault.

Yes they are, and several EU sources tackle this as well. That's the whole talk about ray shields and particle shields. Particle shields are rarely used, but can be if missiles are spotted.
That's probably why the A-wings had to come so suidically close.

We also know that tech does not necessarily scale in the Wars verse. So scaling up shield from the fighters to the capital ships aren't a logical progression.

In general it actually scales up rather nicely.

(lightsabers are a hand held weapon only, there's no large scale equivalent, just like the superlaser has no smaller scale planet busting model [granted the gunships have combining laser cannon attributes])

Lightsabers turned out to be a Jedi/Sith unique gizmo, the recipe being lost to the galaxy. Not that it would change much if scaled up. The range would be awfully, say retardedly short, and a mere shield would protect against them.
The superlaser was an unique weapon, almost developped right off the bat at a stupidly big scale.
Now, one of those Inside the Worlds books shows that there was a superlaser on Geonosis, used in a foundry to melt metal, powered by a fusion core, but it was nowhere near the effects or even firepower of a scaled down Death Star superlaser. And that's knowing Saxton was asked to give his 2c about the content of that book.

Capital ships have holes in their shields, anyone that says differently is going to have to prove it with something other than the EU alternate universe say so.

The EU says holes exist, but they're controlled and opened on command.
Otherwise, I believe you have actually made a poor case of trying to prove that uncontrollable holes existed.

Mr. O., I seem to recall Anakin's fighter in TPM displayed its shields when fired upon by the Droidekas, just as the Droidekas displayed theirs...
So not all shields in SW are invisible when fired upon...

I was really hopping someone would say something of value, because it makes little sense for the large ships not to be shielded.

Also, I have to disregard Mr. Oragahn's reply as he is obviously living in his own world. Anyone who says A-wings shot missiles when it's an obvious red laser effect just like every other rebel gun is, like I said, living in his own world.

So I'm asking for help, please someone give some evidence of a large star wars vessel with shields that completely cover it's hull otherwise I'll be forced to conclude that star wars shields tech is sub par as it's been shown that fighters can bypass it.

Example, for none fully covered ship:

Ep3, the Invisible Hand had no visible damage therefore shields should still have been up before Annie shot the shield generator. This makes sense because if the ship was taking damage then either there should have been bleed through damage or when the shields were collapsing the extra weapon energy not absorbed by the shields would have hit the hull.

Likewise the same can be said about the Executor and the A-wing attack.

So to give evidence that there are shields than there would have to be at least some hull scorching or holes or anything that would constitute visible damage.



Anyway, I want there to be an over shield that protects the entire capital ship like what the naboo fighters have. However, I've seen no evidence of this. We also know that fighters are treated differently that capital ships. Fighters are fast and agile as capital ships are slow and maneuverable. Like I said before, logically scaling up the star wars tech doesn't work.

Well, I'am not sure how familiar you are with the TCW CGI series, Sunburst, but that series in the episode "Downfall of a Droid"[ does suggest that at least the 825 meter long Munificents have all or mostly all shield coverage, which is divided into fore and aft arcs. When General Grievious orders all power to the front shields, he leaves the stern of the Munificents completely unshielded, and vunerable to attack (which Anakin takes advantage of). However at no point did anyone ever suggest attacking the sides of the cruisers, and so we must conclude that like with the starfighters, the Munificents can project two seperate shieldings over the entire hull of the vessel one covering the front, and the other the back half of the ship. It remains unknown if the Republic cruisers (a.k.a Venators) can do that as well.
-Mike

Praeothmin wrote:Mr. O., I seem to recall Anakin's fighter in TPM displayed its shields when fired upon by the Droidekas, just as the Droidekas displayed theirs...
So not all shields in SW are invisible when fired upon...

They didn't flare up when hit. Also, I acknowledged that some shields show up when hit, like those on the CIS battleships in ROTS.

Sunburst wrote:I was really hopping someone would say something of value, because it makes little sense for the large ships not to be shielded.

I'm afraid you're not making much sense anymore. You're making an intial disputable claim about partial shield coverage for warships. It's properly dealt with. You may not like the replies you got, but they certainly contain all the necessary "value" to correct what has to be corrected.

Also, I have to disregard Mr. Oragahn's reply as he is obviously living in his own world. Anyone who says A-wings shot missiles when it's an obvious red laser effect just like every other rebel gun is, like I said, living in his own world.

They're (concussion) missiles, acknowledged by all possible sources.

So I'm asking for help, please someone give some evidence of a large star wars vessel with shields that completely cover it's hull otherwise I'll be forced to conclude that star wars shields tech is sub par as it's been shown that fighters can bypass it.

I did. Not my fault if you ignore evidence.

Example, for none fully covered ship:

Ep3, the Invisible Hand had no visible damage therefore shields should still have been up before Annie shot the shield generator. This makes sense because if the ship was taking damage then either there should have been bleed through damage or when the shields were collapsing the extra weapon energy not absorbed by the shields would have hit the hull.

It's not like we saw the entirety of the warship either!
Besides, as I said, there had been intermittent shielding. The novelization has fighters managing to hit the hull before shields were completely down.
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