Where is the proof of democratic process in the Federation?

[PunkMaister]

OK first of all Cashless does not equal not Capitalistic. Remember that originally the idea of Credit Cards and ATM cards was to create a cashless but still capitalistic society. Off course it never quite worked that way...

How does stating this prove your assertion that that Federation has changed in some fundamental way since the TOS-era? Nothing you have claimed so far has been backed up with any real evidence so far, just wild generalized sweeping assertions. On the other hand, in this thread and others, people have provided numerous pieces of evidence against your claims. Your only response has been to largely ignore that evidence and cling to your wild accusations.

In short, either concede or put some real evidence up.
-Mike

No you are right, is just that I was hoping that somebody could actually bring a smoking gun kind of evidence to shut the warsies up about all this once and for all, yes the circumstantial evidence does point to a free and not a totalitarian society. It just would be nice to have pictures of an actual election campaign nor something along those lines to shove in their faces. I'm a Gater but I've had a soft spot for Trek!

[Mike DiCenso]

And your objections are noted but none of them offer evidence of a representational and democratically elected form of government. Kirk makes refference tio democracy but no evidence of a democratic process is anywhere to be seen. At least in SW and NBSG we get to see that process in one form or another...

That is a poor objection on your part at best. The PT SW movies have at least 2 major characters (Senator Amidala and Chancellor Palpatine) who are politicians, and it is integeral to the PT that the fall of the Republic and democracy is shown. In NBSG, because there is a civilian refugee fleet tagging along with the Galactica that is all that remains of the human Colonials after the Cylon attack, it is again possible to show the political process in detail (also they have several major characters who are politicans or become one; Roslin, Zarek, Baltar, Lee Adama, ect). In Star Trek, the civilian component is not shown very much because the story is centered largely on the adventures of the crew of a starship on deep-space exploration, diplomatic or defense related missions. But the vast majority of the direct and indirect evidence points very strongly to the Federation being a democratic body and cherishing the values of freedom and self-determinination for individuals and planetary governements alike.

So where is your absolute proof that all these characters we've seen in 5 live-action TV series, one cartoon series, and 10 going on 11 movies are lying? And if you claim the characters are indeed lying, then you must support your claim with real evidence. So far you have failed miserably and you continue to act in an obtuse manner by ignoring evidence provided.
-Mike

[PunkMaister]

That is a poor objection on your part at best. The PT SW movies have at least 2 major characters (Senator Amidala and Chancellor Palpatine) who are politicians, and it is integeral to the PT that the fall of the Republic and democracy is shown. In NBSG, because there is a civilian refugee fleet tagging along with the Galactica that is all that remains of the human Colonials after the Cylon attack, it is again possible to show the political process in detail (also they have several major characters who are politicans or become one; Roslin, Zarek, Baltar, Lee Adama, ect). In Star Trek, the civilian component is not shown very much because the story is centered largely on the adventures of the crew of a starship on deep-space exploration, diplomatic or defense related missions. But the vast majority of the direct and indirect evidence points very strongly to the Federation being a democratic body and cherishing the values of freedom and self-determinination for individuals and planetary governements alike.

So where is your absolute proof that all these characters we've seen in 5 live-action TV series, one cartoon series, and 10 going on 11 movies are lying? And if you claim the characters are indeed lying, then you must support your claim with real evidence. So far you have failed miserably and you continue to act in an obtuse manner by ignoring evidence provided.
-Mike

Look at my last post dude, I've already retracted...