I challenge darkstar to a debate

For polite and reasoned discussion of Star Wars and/or Star Trek.
Post Reply
User avatar
Praeothmin
Jedi Master
Posts: 3920
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:24 pm
Location: Quebec City

Re: I challenge darkstar to a debate

Post by Praeothmin » Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:28 pm

Mr. Oragahn, you crack me up...

Now, seeing as you already debunked all my claims, Mr. O, I'll just reply to a few things...
SWST wrote:since the reactor is already gone.
Really, SWST?
I've linked a video showing this was untrue, told you the time factor after the first explosion where we still see the fucking reactor before the second explosion...
Plus, we see or hear no fucking second shot...

THIS are the actual events AS THEY HAPPEN:
-AT-AT aims at the shield generator (no source ever mentions it was shielded) using maximum power;
-We see it fire, and we see the first explosion caused by the impact of its bolts;
-We pan over the generators while the first explosion is still happening and we still see the side of the generator, you liar;
-Then, AND ONLY THEN, do we see the second explosion which vaporizes the shield generator;

And you have the galls to call ME a liar?
Very funny...

Picard
Starship Captain
Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:28 pm

Re: I challenge darkstar to a debate

Post by Picard » Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:55 am

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:So the answer as to why Warsies and Trekkies disagree is that their methodologies are different. The former strictly adheres to a scientific and logical analysis of both universes, the latter is willing to pull the "it's just a film for pete's sake!" card whenever it suits them.
And Warsies ignore Star Wars movies (and logic) whenever it suits them. So your comparision is flawed.

User avatar
Mr. Oragahn
Admiral
Posts: 6865
Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:58 am
Location: Paradise Mountain

Re: I challenge darkstar to a debate

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Sun Apr 29, 2012 6:26 pm

Praeothmin wrote: -AT-AT aims at the shield generator (no source ever mentions it was shielded) using maximum power;
Actually the structure is never identified as a shield generator in the movie, but as a power generator. The shield generator is an EU brain bug turned fact because of causal sloppiness.
A bit like with the case of the domes on Star Destroyers, but with even less reasons to make such a bad connection as it happened for the Executor.

StarWarsStarTrek
Starship Captain
Posts: 881
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:28 pm

Re: I challenge darkstar to a debate

Post by StarWarsStarTrek » Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:34 pm

Praeothmin wrote:Mr. Oragahn, you crack me up...

Now, seeing as you already debunked all my claims, Mr. O, I'll just reply to a few things...
SWST wrote:since the reactor is already gone.
Really, SWST?
I've linked a video showing this was untrue, told you the time factor after the first explosion where we still see the fucking reactor before the second explosion...
Plus, we see or hear no fucking second shot...

THIS are the actual events AS THEY HAPPEN:
-AT-AT aims at the shield generator (no source ever mentions it was shielded) using maximum power;
-We see it fire, and we see the first explosion caused by the impact of its bolts;
-We pan over the generators while the first explosion is still happening and we still see the side of the generator, you liar;
-Then, AND ONLY THEN, do we see the second explosion which vaporizes the shield generator;

And you have the galls to call ME a liar?
Very funny...

So because a portion of generator is still intact, you conclude that the reactor could not have overloaded? Has it occurred to you that perhaps much of the building itself isn't actually storage space for reactants, but perhaps added armor, and crew for maintenance?

And even if your interpretation is correct, the differences are negligible.

1. Even the smaller explosion is calced at around 60 kilotons, at the least, to as much as several hundred kilotons. If you want, I can find the link, but I am under the impression that they are common knowledge here.

2. The fact that the reactor explodes at all completely destroys any idea that Wars technology revolves around nuclear fusion, because hydrogen is actually a very stable fuel that will not explode with the energy of a nuclear bomb, as occurs here.

So, your theory does have merit. Which means that AT-ATs have triple digit kiloton laser cannons. And said weapons are certainly smaller than even the light turbolasers mounted on ISDs, and are, at most, comparable to their point defense laser cannons! Oh, and the entire "ISDs use nuclear fusion!" fiasco dies, as well.

User avatar
Mr. Oragahn
Admiral
Posts: 6865
Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:58 am
Location: Paradise Mountain

Re: I challenge darkstar to a debate

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:09 pm

StarWarsStarTrek wrote:
Praeothmin wrote:Mr. Oragahn, you crack me up...

Now, seeing as you already debunked all my claims, Mr. O, I'll just reply to a few things...
SWST wrote:since the reactor is already gone.
Really, SWST?
I've linked a video showing this was untrue, told you the time factor after the first explosion where we still see the fucking reactor before the second explosion...
Plus, we see or hear no fucking second shot...

THIS are the actual events AS THEY HAPPEN:
-AT-AT aims at the shield generator (no source ever mentions it was shielded) using maximum power;
-We see it fire, and we see the first explosion caused by the impact of its bolts;
-We pan over the generators while the first explosion is still happening and we still see the side of the generator, you liar;
-Then, AND ONLY THEN, do we see the second explosion which vaporizes the shield generator;

And you have the galls to call ME a liar?
Very funny...

So because a portion of generator is still intact, you conclude that the reactor could not have overloaded? Has it occurred to you that perhaps much of the building itself isn't actually storage space for reactants, but perhaps added armor, and crew for maintenance?

And even if your interpretation is correct, the differences are negligible.

1. Even the smaller explosion is calced at around 60 kilotons, at the least, to as much as several hundred kilotons. If you want, I can find the link, but I am under the impression that they are common knowledge here.

2. The fact that the reactor explodes at all completely destroys any idea that Wars technology revolves around nuclear fusion, because hydrogen is actually a very stable fuel that will not explode with the energy of a nuclear bomb, as occurs here.

So, your theory does have merit. Which means that AT-ATs have triple digit kiloton laser cannons. And said weapons are certainly smaller than even the light turbolasers mounted on ISDs, and are, at most, comparable to their point defense laser cannons! Oh, and the entire "ISDs use nuclear fusion!" fiasco dies, as well.
It's not like there could be a million power conduits and capacitors that could make nice explosions when subjected to the fire of an AT-AT, only leading to the destruction of the main section shortly after. The main section of course housing the power of a small artificial star, that is, sufficiently powerful to maintain a shield over a wide area capable of deflecting the fire of Death Sqaudron.
Surely, someone thinking logically would guess that blowing up that kind of reactor couldn't go unnoticed, because the problem wouldn't be the non flammable nature of the fuel or the fact that a fusion reaction requires heat and pressure to high levels to be maintained, but the fact that at the very moment the reactor was hit, it probably already was in the process of producing a new batch of terajoules or petajoules over a second, with other high levels of energy already channeled out to the shield generator.
And there is, of course, the possibility that the fuel used in SW is flammable. See Robert Scott Anderson's page and JMS' "diesel fusion engines" thread.
Please notice that I already told SWST about those but instead of providing counter evidence to all the observed facts presented on both RSA's website and JMS' thread, he chose to ignore all and reboot the topic, and accuse others of not knowing anything about science, fusion and what not.
This is another violation of rules.

User avatar
Praeothmin
Jedi Master
Posts: 3920
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:24 pm
Location: Quebec City

Re: I challenge darkstar to a debate

Post by Praeothmin » Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:58 pm

SWST wrote:. Even the smaller explosion is calced at around 60 kilotons, at the least, to as much as several hundred kilotons. If you want, I can find the link, but I am under the impression that they are common knowledge here.
Hell no, you're not getting off that easy, you will provide these calcs...
AND an explanation as to the secondary explosion... :)
The fact that the reactor explodes at all completely destroys any idea that Wars technology revolves around nuclear fusion, because hydrogen is actually a very stable fuel that will not explode with the energy of a nuclear bomb, as occurs here.
Wow, as if I give a fuck...
I never made that claim...
Which means that AT-ATs have triple digit kiloton laser cannons.
Prove it!

Post Reply