Neocolonialism, terrorism, and human rights, oh my!

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:25 pm

Mr. Oragahn wrote:
PunkMaister wrote:
How many attacks the state-sponsored Israeli terrorism has committed since 2001, directly and indirectly?

We could speak of Lebanon (2006) or South Ossetia (at least 1500 civilians killed, just for the kicks, with military help from Israel and blessings of the US).

South Ossetia? You mean Georgia? Wow so now the Jews are according to you part of some world wide conspiracy! Why does not that surprise me!

2046 · Post by **2046** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 12:13 pm

Leftist international political thought can be replicated by taking large-scale facts and inverting them, then seeking any excuse to back up the inversion.

For instance, Israel is a tiny homeland, made for a group that was targeted for extermination 70 years ago, surrounded by much larger neighbors who explicitly want it destroyed. Some even go blow themselves up upon its soil.

Normal people would view the suicide bombers ... avowed terrorists ... as badguys and the Israelis as defenders of their homeland. Normal people would be predisposed to root for the underdog.

Lefties, however, view the Israelis as the aggressors. They back this up with Israel holding buffer zones after totally owning the ass of the Arab world that was aiming to destroy it back in the day, whereas everyone else views it as just good international business.

(And what's fun here is that even if I applaud the fact that they made the tough call and went with the only choice, some loony is gonna claim that I'm a neocon and love the violence required.)

The same sort of "inversion reasoning" holds true for other matters, e.g. the Iraq casualties and the US vs. Terrorism.

It is a symptom of the overall problem of leftism, being that emotionalism supplants reason. The way one wants the world to be is taken in the mind to be more important than the way it is, and a pattern of mental mistakes thus begins. The fact that these days there's a huge support group for such mistakes (not seeking cure, but further mistakes) only makes the mental condition worse.

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 1:09 pm

PunkMaister wrote:
Mr. Oragahn wrote:
PunkMaister wrote:
How many attacks the state-sponsored Israeli terrorism has committed since 2001, directly and indirectly?

We could speak of Lebanon (2006) or South Ossetia (at least 1500 civilians killed, just for the kicks, with military help from Israel and blessings of the US).
South Ossetia? You mean Georgia? Wow so now the Jews are according to you part of some world wide conspiracy! Why does not that surprise me!

You know about the Olympic Games, right? You remember that totally illegal invasion of South Ossetia by Georgia during those games, right?
Probably not. it was purposely started during the games so people would not look and care.

Just ask yourself why this ever happened and where Georgia's military support comes from.

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 1:36 pm

2046 wrote:For instance, Israel is a tiny homeland, made for a group that was targeted for extermination 70 years ago

Like many people across history, some even more. Or do I have to add terrible selective memory to the list of your defects?

... surrounded by much larger neighbors who explicitly want it destroyed.

Amalgam, generality. That's so easy. Let's dumb things down and, if possible, brush everybody with the same foul paint in one sweep. Makes it easier to sell on FOX NEWS.

Some even go blow themselves up upon its soil.

One wonders why. I don't condone it, but you have to ask yourself why humans decide to end their lives in such way, how they are willing to reject their inner code for survival and love to the point they're finding their explanation and solution in an extreme application of theology.

Normal people would view the suicide bombers ... avowed terrorists ... as badguys and the Israelis as defenders of their homeland. Normal people would be predisposed to root for the underdog.

Your warped manichean vision of it aside, there's much to argue about who's the true underdog here.

Lefties, however, view the Israelis as the aggressors. They back this up with Israel holding buffer zones after totally owning the ass of the Arab world that was aiming to destroy it back in the day, whereas everyone else views it as just good international business.

For memory -again- the Israeli were totally fucking owned in Lebanon. And it's not going to get any better. The super right-wing nationalistic Israeli government deeply craves for a revenge.
There's been rumours that China, Syria and Russia were readying some resources or troops for Lebanon, seeing how the tension never deflated.

(And what's fun here is that even if I applaud the fact that they made the tough call and went with the only choice, some loony is gonna claim that I'm a neocon and love the violence required.)

Your one sided "facts" are typical neocon rhetoric, and you have formerly demonstrated your position as a neocon.
You may not consider yourself as such, but I find the qualificative fitting nonetheless.

The same sort of "inversion reasoning" holds true for other matters, e.g. the Iraq casualties and the US vs. Terrorism.

Your reasoning is so deeply flawed and overly simplistic that it wouldn't even stick for Uwe Boll's next plot.
You may want to know that many Palestinians have yet not swallowed how hundreds of thousands of their people were formerly kicked out of the land which would become the State of Israel in 1948.
I'm sure you can understand why it immediately resulted in an increase of tensions between Arabs and Israeli, among other things even predating the creation of this state.

It is a symptom of the overall problem of leftism, being that emotionalism supplants reason.
The way one wants the world to be is taken in the mind to be more important than the way it is, and a pattern of mental mistakes thus begins. The fact that these days there's a huge support group for such mistakes (not seeking cure, but further mistakes) only makes the mental condition worse.

Well, your absurd attack aside, it actually has nothing to do with left or right, but getting the minimum of facts straight, and being willing to step out of pathological denial as it's largely maintained in Occidental countries (I know, I'm getting the same one sided crap through the tube everyday).

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 2:41 pm

Mr. Oragahn wrote:
PunkMaister wrote:
Mr. Oragahn wrote: How many attacks the state-sponsored Israeli terrorism has committed since 2001, directly and indirectly?

We could speak of Lebanon (2006) or South Ossetia (at least 1500 civilians killed, just for the kicks, with military help from Israel and blessings of the US).
South Ossetia? You mean Georgia? Wow so now the Jews are according to you part of some world wide conspiracy! Why does not that surprise me!
You know about the Olympic Games, right? You remember that totally illegal invasion of South Ossetia by Georgia during those games, right?
Probably not. it was purposely started during the games so people would not look and care.

Just ask yourself why this ever happened and where Georgia's military support comes from.

Get real will you! Sout Osettia was and is in fact still recognized by most of the word as part of sovereing Georgia territory. There was an internal conflict there but it was Georgia's problem. The Russians then invaded and a separate state was declared at least for now because Russia made clear it intends to annex Ossetia into the Russian Federation despite the fact that the now president of "Osetia" refuses. And there you have it another shining example of someone ignoring historical facts because they are inconvenient and inventing whatever else comes into their twisted little minds such as your vaunted Jewish world domination conspiracy of which you have yet to present any evidence.

More on Georgia and Ossetia here and it is from your favorite one stop source Wikipedia by the way:
South Ossetia

Kane Starkiller · Post by **Kane Starkiller** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 3:07 pm

Could the people defending US actions in Iraq actually stick to defending it's actions rather than resorting to sweeping generalizations about "leftists" and "hate for the Jews" or whatever Russians are doing this week?
Speaking of Georgia and South Ossetia replace Georgia with Serbia and South Ossetia with Kosovo and you have a very similar situation.

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:48 pm

Punkmaister wrote:Sout Osettia was and is in fact still recognized by most of the word as part of sovereing Georgia territory.

After the majority of the people living there voting for their independance.
So, in this case, it seems democracy isn't worth much...

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:50 pm

Kane Starkiller wrote:Could the people defending US actions in Iraq actually stick to defending it's actions rather than resorting to sweeping generalizations about "leftists" and "hate for the Jews" or whatever Russians are doing this week?
Speaking of Georgia and South Ossetia replace Georgia with Serbia and South Ossetia with Kosovo and you have a very similar situation.

Mmm.. No actually because NATO nor any of the allies had any intentions of absorbing Kosovo as Russia does with Osettia so there...

Praeothmin wrote:
Punkmaister wrote:Sout Osettia was and is in fact still recognized by most of the word as part of sovereing Georgia territory.
After the majority of the people living there voting for their independance.
So, in this case, it seems democracy isn't worth much...

Ah yes and looked where it got them just one step away of being swalloed by the Bear that first posed as their friends and allies and instigated the move toward indepence in the first place. Yeah that worked great...

And while you are at it please bring some evidence of ethnic cleansing and mass graves as it was the case in the former republics of Yugoslavia.

And still no one has brought in evidence of this vaunted Jewish worldwide domination conspiracy that Mr Oraghan so staunchly defends... I'm still awaiting for that evidence and as once a long time ago a US UN ambassador told his Russian counterpart during the height of the Cuban Missile Crissis I can wait until hell freezes over if that is what you want! :D

Feldercarb · Post by **Feldercarb** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 8:54 pm

Kane Starkiller wrote:Could the people defending US actions in Iraq actually stick to defending it's actions rather than resorting to sweeping generalizations about "leftists" and "hate for the Jews" or whatever Russians are doing this week?
Speaking of Georgia and South Ossetia replace Georgia with Serbia and South Ossetia with Kosovo and you have a very similar situation.

Don't discourage them; I'm very interested in hearing about this mental condition that, conveniently enough, is not listed in the DSM.

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:56 pm

Feldercarb wrote:
Kane Starkiller wrote:Could the people defending US actions in Iraq actually stick to defending it's actions rather than resorting to sweeping generalizations about "leftists" and "hate for the Jews" or whatever Russians are doing this week?
Speaking of Georgia and South Ossetia replace Georgia with Serbia and South Ossetia with Kosovo and you have a very similar situation.
Don't discourage them; I'm very interested in hearing about this mental condition that, conveniently enough, is not listed in the DSM.

Oh pray tell so now having a difference of opinion from you leftards constitutes a mental disease! Wow just wow!

Feldercarb · Post by **Feldercarb** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:26 pm

PunkMaister wrote:
Oh pray tell so now having a difference of opinion from you leftards constitutes a mental disease! Wow just wow!

Why don't you read Darkstars post up there where he calls "leftist" thinking a mental condition.

Post by **Jedi Master Spock** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:38 pm

PunkMaister wrote:Oh pray tell so now having a difference of opinion from you leftards constitutes a mental disease! Wow just wow!

Point of order: Neither "leftard" nor "rightard" are going to contribute to constructive discussion, and in fact should be considered flames.

Point of order #2: This is the fourth time I have given you a warning within the past week. Per the enforcement policy, I am giving you a one day temporary ban.

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Wed Apr 01, 2009 1:59 am

PunkMaister wrote:More on Georgia and Ossetia here and it is from your favorite one stop source Wikipedia by the way:
South Ossetia

Wait. Is all your evidence coming from wikipedia?
I'd reconsider doing so when it comes to the geopolitical structure and history of certain critical countries (like, erm, once again, Israel).

PunkMaister wrote:Mmm.. No actually because NATO nor any of the allies had any intentions of absorbing Kosovo as Russia does with Osettia so there...

You know, when Russian forces pushed back Georgian forces out of Ossetia, I don't recall the Russians annexing the country.

Praeothmin wrote:And while you are at it please bring some evidence of ethnic cleansing and mass graves as it was the case in the former republics of Yugoslavia.

There's much than meets the eye.

And still no one has brought in evidence of this vaunted Jewish worldwide domination conspiracy that Mr Oraghan so staunchly defends...

Erm, I wonder if I should reply or not.
I merely pointed out how Israel has been involved in the aggression of certain regions or countries.
It would help your case if you could argue with higher standards than absurd appeals to ridicule (that said, one will recognize another typical neocon tactic of debate).

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:29 pm

Mr. Oragahn wrote:
Praeothmin wrote:
And while you are at it please bring some evidence of ethnic cleansing and mass graves as it was the case in the former republics of Yugoslavia.

There's much than meets the eye.

That wasn't from me, it was also from Punkmaister, like the other quotes you had... :)

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Thu Apr 02, 2009 4:42 pm

Wow attacked from all sides at once! Now I know in the flesh how it must be like to be conservative in the middle of the freaking Bill Maher show.

To think a comparison of SDN as some kind of virtual police state to real world police states started all this crap!

The last thing I wanted was to join this board to discuss politics there are plenty of other boards for that that I do go too for that when I feel like bashing heads.
Not too mention that I already get plenty of beatiful death threats from Muslims and leftists alike such this one:

freemason1992 wrote in a PM elsewhere...
http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/8400/1236876355194.jpg

I am really coming after you for being a member of this site.

I've edited the PM so it does not directly display the disturbing picture...

So forgive for not wanting to play anymore I'm not conceding to anything but if in your narrow twisted mindset that is what you people want to believe fine...

BTW I've refrained as much as possible my use of derogatory language and flames.