Riker - what would you have done differently

[Who is like God arbour]

Again and again I see, that some wanna-be tactician blame Riker for loosing the Enterprise to a couple dozen Ferengi in "Rascals" and ended up destroying the Enterprise when faced against a 20 year old BoP in "ST: Generations".

But what has he done wrong?

What could he have done differently in these situations, looked at it ex ante?

Is he really incompetent?

[Enterprise E]

I don't remember enough about "Rascals", but as for "Generations", there may be some things we don't know. For example, I would have kept firing phasers, and that's only assuming that the forward torpedo launcher was down, which it may have been since they didn't fire any torpedoes until they got the Bird of Prey to cloak. Also, the moment I turned around, I would have fired a volley of torpedoes at the BoP as well as rear phasers. Also, we don't see too much of the space battle given that we are looking at the bridge for some of it, so Worf may have been giving everything they had at the time. Remember, the Klingon officer did say that their shields were holding (I think the ship was shaking a bit as well), indicating that they probably took more than one phaser blast, jest before the ionic pulse forced the Bird of Prey to cloak. Also, as for saving the ship, I don't know what could have been done. The hull damage didn't look to be that bad, at least it didn't look like something that should have resulted in a warp core breach. I think that if it had been any other ship, it would have survived. Look at the E-E in Nemesis. If that were the E-D, it would have probably exploded after the first volley of fire given the hull damage the ship received in the battle.

[Cocytus]

An engineer reported to LaForge right before he looked at the Master Systems Display (giving Lursa and B'Etor the E-D's shield frequency) that the port plasma relays were experiencing technical difficulties. "I'd like to run a diagnostic on the port plasma relays. I think one of the generators is fluctuating." The first two hits the E-D takes don't seem to rattle it (or Riker) all that much. But the next disruptor blast strikes the Engineering section portside, which produces a large explosion on the bridge. A hit to a primary EPS (assuming the engineer is talking about the electroplasma relays) feeder would have caused power shortages shipwide, possibly affecting the weapons systems. A generator explosion, feedback, power surge or any type of sudden energy release along the EPS lines could have caused considerable damage to the engineering section's crucial technologies. (LaForge states the magnetic interlocks are ruptured right before the coolant leak sprouts.) Perhaps if the E-D weren't experiencing trouble with a critical system at that very moment, (and weren't hit in the precise area that system was located) she would have fared much better.

[Mike DiCenso]

I believe it was the two torpedo hits to the E-D's engineering section, along with the subsequent disruptor hits that likely did the ship in. The E-D could have escaped on warp, but the deliberate hits to the ship's stardrive probably caused enough damage to prevent that, and provide enough power to weapons.

What people are really missing here is that neither Riker, nor Geordi (or anyone else for that matter) tries rotating the shield frequencies once they knew they were compromised.
-Mike

[2046]

What could he have done differently in these situations, looked at it ex ante?

Torp-spam.

'Nuff said.

[Who is like God arbour]

What people are really missing here is that neither Riker, nor Geordi (or anyone else for that matter tries rotating the shield frequencies once they knew they were compromised.
-Mike

I have read somewhere, they have changed the modulation. But, because they have not known, that the Klingons see, what Geordi has seen, wile setting a new shield modulation, they couldn't explain, why the Klingons are able to penetrate the shields nevertheless. So they have concluded, that further shield modulation changes are unproductive.

What could he have done differently in these situations, looked at it ex ante?

Torp-spam.

'Nuff said.

What is torp-spam?
Do you think, that they should send the Klingon torpedos a spam?

[Narsil]

No, torp-spam is essentially firing a LOT of torpedoes at something until it's not there any more, or you run out of torpedoes. Whichever comes first.

[Mike DiCenso]

What people are really missing here is that neither Riker, nor Geordi (or anyone else for that matter) tries rotating the shield frequencies once they knew they were compromised.
-Mike

I have read somewhere, they have changed the modulation. But, because they have not known, that the Klingons see, what Geordi has seen, wile setting a new shield modulation, they couldn't explain, why the Klingons are able to penetrate the shields nevertheless. So they have concluded, that further shield modulation changes are unproductive.

That must be from fanon speculation, the non-canon novelization, or an early draft script, but it is not anywhere in the movie dialog.
-Mike

[Mike DiCenso]

Again and again I see, that some wanna-be tactician blame Riker for loosing the Enterprise to a couple dozen Ferengi in "Rascals"

If Riker simply lost the E-D to a few Ferengi in "Rascals", it would be one thing, but the E-D's shields were taken down by at least two BoPs, and the reason for surrender was because the families had been captured. Kendall and I discuss this in detail in the old Should Picard Have Been Retired After BoBW thread.

Once the E-D had been captured, all the able-bodied adults were transported to the surface, so there was not much in the way of crew or adult family members to lead a resistance with.
-Mike

[Mike DiCenso]

What could he have done differently in these situations, looked at it ex ante?

Torp-spam.

'Nuff said.

Assuming that the torpedo launchers had not been knocked out in the opening attack, then yeah, full-yeild, full-spread torpedoes with main phasers at the same time.
-Mike

[Who is like God arbour]

No, torp-spam is essentially firing a LOT of torpedoes at something until it's not there any more, or you run out of torpedoes. Whichever comes first.

In that case, it brings up the questions, how many torpedos can the Enterprise fire in a limited period and how many torpedos would be necessary to overcome the shields and destroy the Bird of Prey and vice versa, how many torpedos can the Bird of Prey fire in the same time and how many torpedos would be necessary to destroy the not by her shields protected Enterprise?

[Roondar]

No, torp-spam is essentially firing a LOT of torpedoes at something until it's not there any more, or you run out of torpedoes. Whichever comes first.

In that case, it brings up the questions, how many torpedos can the Enterprise fire in a limited period and how many torpedos would be necessary to overcome the shields and destroy the Bird of Prey and vice versa, how many torpedos can the Bird of Prey fire in the same time and how many torpedos would be necessary to destroy the not by her shields protected Enterprise?

Looking at the movie it would appear about three/four hits would be plenty to do enough damage to destroy the E-D ;)

The E-D has shown vastly better rates of fire (on it's photons) than any BoP ever has though.

A better question would by why (if we disregard plot-strength shields) the E-D had trouble breeching the BoP's shields in the first place. I'm assuming they had power trouble at the time?

[Mike DiCenso]

No, torp-spam is essentially firing a LOT of torpedoes at something until it's not there any more, or you run out of torpedoes. Whichever comes first.

In that case, it brings up the questions, how many torpedos can the Enterprise fire in a limited period and how many torpedos would be necessary to overcome the shields and destroy the Bird of Prey and vice versa, how many torpedos can the Bird of Prey fire in the same time and how many torpedos would be necessary to destroy the not by her shields protected Enterprise?

The E-D in "Arsenal of Freedom" [TNG1], has demonstrated the amazing ability to simultaeously fire up to 5 photon torpedoes, and in episodes like "Q Who?" and "The Nth Degree" [TNG4], rapid fire in succession groups of two torpedoes.
-Mike

[2046]

The E-D in "Arsenal of Freedom" [TNG1], has demonstrated the amazing ability to simultaeously fire up to 5 photon torpedoes, and in episodes like "Q Who?" and "The Nth Degree" [TNG4], rapid fire in succession groups of two torpedoes.
-Mike

The five-torp cluster is nice, but with the two-torps . . . are you talking about real torpedoes fired some fractions of a second apart, or the de-interlacing artifacts that are like a single frame away from one another?

Just checkin'.

[Mike DiCenso]

I'am talking about this, and this
-Mike