"The Pegasus" Remastered

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Mike DiCenso
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"The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by Mike DiCenso » Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:33 pm

TrekCore has a series of videos covering the differences between the original TNG FX and the new CGI FX for the HD Blueray remasters. Just recently they did one for "The Pegasus" and right away the new FX for the E-D entering the asteroid fissure is subtle, but shows the ship slightly smaller than in the original. In the video here at 3:53 to 4:01, you can view for yourself and decide if that is so.
-Mike

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by 359 » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:55 pm

It does appear to be ever so slightly shorter in the HD version.

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by Mike DiCenso » Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:21 pm

The remastered CGI E-D is slightly smaller. Measuring it in full screen on my 15" x 17.5" laptop monitor, the E-D in the original footage is 2.27" in length while the CGI version is 2.20". The chasm height remains the same in both; 3.21". So that means the chasm height is 906 m in the original while the CGI remastered one is 936 m.
-Mike

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Mr. Oragahn
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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Sun May 08, 2016 3:01 pm

This measuring method has great limits when using the length of A against the height of B. A slight rotation in the camera would elongate or shorten the E-D whilst not altering the aperture's height.
Note, by the way, that it is the aft of the nacelles that is shorter (that is, the ends have been shifted to the right on screen, closer to the center of the ship). The E-D isn't the only object to be affected. The right edge of the entrance is located at the same position between both editions; same as with the E-D's saucer front, but the outer left edge of the asteroid has also been shifted some pixels to the right. That's not surprising, as both the right edge of the hole and the tip of the saucer are in the middle of the screen, yet the ends of both nacelles and the outer edge of the asteroid are on the left side. The camera isn't orientated exactly the same between both editions and, technically, you could also claim that the asteroid is narrower.
You should compare the entrance's height to the ship's, but the original shot is so blurred that the end results would vary greatly.

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by Mike DiCenso » Sun May 08, 2016 7:12 pm

I can't really understand what you're saying exactly here. But if I think you're saying is correct, then I remeasured the two version in the vertical height and got a similar outcome; .59" for the original and .54 for the CGI one. And yes, I did take the modest change in the E-D's orientation into account.
-Mike

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Thu May 12, 2016 9:53 am

Basically, the vertical axis that runs through the camera is used as the rotational axis here.
From the old version to the modern one, we see that things are not filmed under the exact same angle.
So the E-D is a bit more cramped from head to tail. This, however, affects all objects being filmed.

The change in dimensions is noticed in only certain areas of the screen. Typically, if the vertical axis of the camera were to be projected onto the 2D screen, then it would almost bisect the screen.
Therefore, the further away a point would be from this middle vertical line, the more its position would be affected by any slight rotation of the camera.

Pick a pen, hold it up. Then pick some elongated object that is about two inches long, and hold it horizontally. Then have one of its ends touch the pen.
Then make the object rotate around the pen without ever losing contact with the pen. Observe that from your perspective, if your vision was a 2D screen, the "pixels" that compose the distant edges of the object would appear to move much more than the edges of the same object that are in contact with the pen.

Or let's use a plastic transparent ruler. Hold it horizontally. Paint five dots, one on each of its edges, two at the center of each of the ruler's halves, and one at its exact center, then rotate the ruler on its vertical axis. Project your vision as a 2D screen. You notice that the dot at the center of the ruler doesn't move. The dots at mid-radius move, and the dots on the ends of the ruler move even more.
That's the same problem here.

That's what is going on in this case: both the asteroid and the E-D see their apparent screen width change, and the respective parts that are in fact in different positions between the low def and the HD are those closer to the edges of the screen.
Notice that the left edge of the asteroid has also moved to the right of the screen, just like the tips of the E-D's nacelles. In the later case, this leads you to think the ship is shorter (and therefore the chasm even bigger).
It is not.

You just have to rotate a camera a bit on its vertical axis to alter the apparent size of objects on the width axis after all. However, heights won't change on screen.
In other words, measuring the height of an object (or a hole here) by using, as a reference, the width of an object that is subject to change because of the slightest vertical rotation of the camera, is not a safe way to gauge the real size of the chasm.

Now, had the E-D's "saucer" section been perfectly circular, this slight change of angle wouldn't have mattered and I'd encourage using the saucer section.
But it is an ovoid; however, it's also very close to the center of the screen and thus less prone to distortion.
The best way to measure the chasm is to use a section of the E-D for which you know that any rotation of the camera won't change anything.
Generally, this means looking for sections that are either circular or cylindrical. Anything that involves a circle anyway.

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by 2046 » Thu May 19, 2016 12:34 pm

Just to be helpful:

http://www.st-v-sw.net/images/Trek/Seri ... isonSD.jpg

Too big to img tag, sorry.

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Tue May 31, 2016 5:01 pm

Err.. thanks but what is being proven there?

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Re: "The Pegasus" Remastered

Post by 2046 » Tue Jun 14, 2016 4:16 am

Absolutely nothing. Just trying to give those conversing an easier reference.

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