Starfleet Jedi

After watching several episodes of TNG recently I noticed a pattern in how much damage starships seem to take from ship-to-ship combat. But first I'll take a look at several specific instances.

"Star Trek: Generations":

The Enterprise engages a Klingon Bird of Prey which penetrates their shields with a torpedo at the beginning of combat, suffering minor (visible) damage.
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TNG: "The Wounded":

The Enterprise is hit with its shields down by an unknown class of Cardassian war ship, of inferior power.

O'Brien: "Something's wrong."
Computer: "Red alert. Take emergency stations."

Worf: "Cardassian ship preparing to fire again, sir."
Picard: "Increase power to forward shields. Hail them again, Mister Worf."
Riker: "What the hell is he doing? Damage report."
Worf: "Minor damage to secondary hull before we put our shields up, sir. No casualties. Structural integrity intact."


DS9: "The Jem'Hadar":

The USS Odyssey comes under fire from several Jem'Hadar fighters which penetrate its shields with their weapons. The Odyssey suffers minimal visible hull damage.
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"Star Trek: The Wrath Of Khan":

The Enterprise is fired on by the USS Reliant while her shields were down causing minimal destruction of the outer hull. The Enterprise returns fire again causing minimal visible damage.
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Now opposite these instances we have occasions where scored hits cause immense destruction to the hull.

DS9: "Sacrifice of Angles":

While flying alongside the Defiant, the Sitak and Majestic have their shields overpowered resting in the destruction of much of the ships.
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DS9: "Tears of the Prophets":

During the attack on the chin'toka system, many starships were hit by orbital defensive fire and had their shield overwhelmed resulting in extensive hull damage.
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Now from this information, the observed ability of these weapons to totally wreck a starship and how they sometimes don't, we can try to determine a reason why such damage does not occur in these specific instances on a repeated basis. The difference between taking significant damage and taking little, without main shields, seems to be related to whether or not the ship has been overwhelmed or their primary defense systems circumvented. In fact The Wrath of Khan gives an explanation for the minute damage.

While the Enterprise's main shields were down, they did intensify some form of a defensive field as stated by Saavik. This is likely a strengthening of the powerful structural integrity fields [SIF] that intensify the resiliency of the ship's hull. And again in TNG: "The Wounded" we hear Worf mention that the structural integrity of the ship is holding. I would argue that this is what these instances have in common, that in the instances of minor damage the weapons fire struck the hull while the ships were under full power, and thus was resisted by the hull and intense strength of the SIF at the time.

In contrast, the examples where a starship is drilled through is generally associated with shield failure. From this it would seem that in keeping the shields up the ship was drained of so much energy through combat that they can no longer support the same level of SIF induced resiliency resulting in far greater destruction from being hit without shields. And in VOY: "Scientific Method" as Voyager attempts to fly between two pulsars their shields are knocked out and we hear from Kim: "Shields have failed. Structural integrity is down to twenty percent." This shows how by the time shields are down structural integrity, presumably the SIF, has been severely weakened. This could be due to damage, power loss, or (most likely) both.

We see a pattern of starships not taking significant (hull) damage even without the main shields protecting the ship. Of course with the power of their weapons what does get through the hull still does plenty of damage to the interior systems. So we are looking at a defense system with three main layers, main shields, the hull, and structural integrity fields. The main shields are, of course, the best way to protect the ship. But at full power even without the shields the combination of the hull and SIF seems to be sufficient to protect the ship from massive destruction that would be the result of phaser and photon torpedo hits.

http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/view ... f=8&t=6699

Franchise: Star Trek Series: The Next Generation Season: 6 Episode: 20 Title: The Chase wrote: WORF: Direct hit on our port nacelle. They are powering up for another volley. 

RIKER: Let's make it look good. Ensign, release the inertial dampers. 

ENSIGN: Aye, sir. 

WORF: They are firing. 


(everything shakes as the Cardassians target the nacelle again and fly off) 


PICARD: Report, Number One.

RIKER: The power boost to the structural integrity field protected the nacelles. We used the inertial dampers to simulate complete shield failure.

NU'DAQ: It is fortunate that your Engineer discovered Gul Ocett's attempt to tamper with your defensive systems. Maht-H'a. Status.

KLINGON [OC]: Minor damage to starboard nacelle. We will be operational in less than one hour.

NU'DAQ: What? You incompetent Top'a. You were supposed to be prepared.

WORF: The Cardassian vessels have set a course for Rahm Izad.

PICARD: Well, it won't take them long to realise that Rahm Izad is the wrong planet. Captain, you're welcome to join us.

NU'DAQ: I will go with you.

PICARD: Ensign, set in a course for the Vilmoran System. Warp nine.

ENSIGN: Aye, sir.

PICARD: Engage.

359 wrote:Now opposite these instances we have occasions where scored hits cause immense destruction to the hull.

DS9: "Sacrifice of Angles":

While flying alongside the Defiant, the Sitak and Majestic have their shields overpowered resting in the destruction of much of the ships.
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DS9: "Tears of the Prophets":

During the attack on the chin'toka system, many starships were hit by orbital defensive fire and had their shield overwhelmed resulting in extensive hull damage.
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1) How long was the battle in Sacrifice of the Angels?

2) Both episode used stock footage and failed to show shields at all. They were done on the cheap, and that would to me make them poor examples.

The battle itself lasted a total of five hours as the fleet had broken through as the Defiant emerged from the wormhole following the destruction of the Dominion reinforcements.

Stock footage? It was used as stock later, but in those it was original. And they always talk about shields. How the Dominion can penetrate shields, how the Federation adjusted their shields. It's safe to say the battle started with ships having shields despite only showing shields twice that I can think of in DS9, even when they are stated to be in place.

You know, the whole SIF as shield was something I brought up a while ago during my response to Brian Young.

Shields also seem to act as capacitors since you can drain them (they don't remain consistent in power output) and we have this from VOY's "Equinox Part 1":

RANSOM: Stay on your course.

BURKE:Shields are down to twenty nine percent. They're breaking through.

RANSOM: Let them.

BURKE: Sir?

RANSOM: Take the shields offline and recharge the emitters. That'll bring them up to full power.

BURKE: The charging cycle takes forty five seconds. We'll be vulnerable.

RANSOM: We'll be dead if we don't get the shields back up. Arm yourselves! Drop shields. Recharge cycle?

BURKE: Thirty seconds.

RANSOM: There!

(An energy ball appears by the ceiling. They shoot at it. Others appear and get shot at.)
RANSOM: Time?

BURKE: Ten seconds. (A two-armed creature with big teeth screeches out of one of the energy balls and attacks a crewman. He dies immediately, his skin turning grey and dry. More creatures appear.)


The shields take about 45 seconds to recharge in this instance.
-Mike

Mainly I think that people generally underestimate how not helpless a starship is even without their shields. Sure they won't fair to well against a ship with shields, but it'll provide protection long enough to get some shields up unless they're quite unlucky. Plus I was watching TNG: "The Wounded" and began to notice the pattern of damage.

That description of the shields puzzled me at first. I don't recall any other times where shields can be simply recharged after failure. However, I would guess that this is a special case as we are not looking at large heavy attacks, but instead at multiple low-stess attacks over an extended duration. It could be that the lack of stress/damage to the shield emitters simply left them depleted of energy but still fully functional. Unlike when the shields are brought down forcefully by heavy weapons fire.

Additionally the 45 second figure gives an interesting comparison between shield strength and warp core output.

359 wrote:That description of the shields puzzled me at first. I don't recall any other times where shields can be simply recharged after failure.

Not necessarily. There is this from TOS' "The Doomsday Machine where Scotty and his damage control party on the badly damaged U.S.S. Constellation not only got the impulse engines restored, recharged a phaser bank, but also...

[Constellation Auxiliary Control]
SCOTT [OC]: Captain Kirk.

KIRK: Yes, Scotty.

[Constellation Engineering]

SCOTT: I've hooked in ship's communication. The best I can give you on impulse is one third power. The shields are up but they won't last long.

So with just impulse engines (damaged and low-powered ones at that), the shields were brought back online. Then there is the battle from "The Elann of Troyius" and the recharging of the shields to full power once new dilithium crystals are installed:

First the state of the shields on minimal impulse power before the crystals:

SULU: He's coming in again, sir.

KIRK: Mister Sulu, prepare on my order to turn quickly to port. Try and protect the
number four shield.

SULU: Aye, sir.

KIRK: Now, Sulu. hard a-port!

(Another disrupter hit)

SULU: Shields holding, but weakened, sir.

UHURA: Captain. Message coming in.

KLINGON [on viewscreen]: Enterprise, our readings confirm your power extremely low, your shields buckling. This is your last chance to surrender.

SULU: Captain, number four shield just collapsed. Impulse power down to thirty one percent.


The shields were failing and the number 4 shield was gone. Later the shields go up to full power thanks to the new crystals:

KIRK: You and Spock get up here. Sulu, prepare for warp manoeuvres.

SULU: Aye, sir.

KIRK: Chekov, arm photon torpedoes.

CHEKOV: Photon torpedoes ready.

SULU: Warp power to the shields, Captain?

KIRK: Negative. His sensors will pick up our power increase. The more helpless he thinks we are, the closer he'll come. As he passes, I want to cut in warp drive. We'll pivot at warp two and bring all tubes to bear.

SULU: Aye, sir.

KIRK: Mister Chekov, give him a full spread of photon torpedoes.

CHEKOV: Aye, Captain.

(Scott and Spock enter)

SULU: One hundred thousand kilometres.

KIRK: Scotty, stand by to cut in warp drive.

SCOTT: Fluctuation. It's the shape of the crystals. I was afraid of that.

SULU: Seventy five. Seventy. Sixty. Fifty.

KIRK: Fire at minimum range.

SULU: Forty.

SCOTT: She won't steady down.

SULU: Thirty.

KIRK: Warp in, Scotty. Full power to shields.
(The Klingons fire.)

KIRK: Warp factor two. Bring us to course one four eight mark three.

(The Klingons fire again)

KIRK: Chekov, photon torpedoes. Fire!

CHEKOV: Aye, sir.

(Six torpedoes go, but not all hit the Klingons)

SULU: Direct hit amidships by photon torpedo.

SPOCK: Damage to Klingon number three shield. Number four shield obliterated. Loss of manoeuvre power.

CHEKOV: He's badly damaged, Captain. Continuing away at reduced speed.


So all shields were powered back up to full despite bombardment by disruptors.
-Mike

359 wrote: Stock footage? It was used as stock later, but in those it was original.

I doubt they made the footage for only that episode.

359 wrote: And they always talk about shields. How the Dominion can penetrate shields, how the Federation adjusted their shields. It's safe to say the battle started with ships having shields despite only showing shields twice that I can think of in DS9, even when they are stated to be in place.

Season 5 Episode 2 The Ship:
The Federation captures a Dominion bug fighter.

Season 5 Episode 26 Call To Arms:
Deep Space Nine's shields are effective against Phased Polaron Beams.
DAMAR: Sir, the station's shields are holding. 

WEYOUN: Impossible. Federation shields have always proven useless against our weapons. 

DUKAT: I've found it wise to never underestimate the Federation's technical skill or Captain Sisko's resourcefulness. Damar, bring us around for another pass.

Season 6 Episode 6 Sacrifice of Angels:
No shield effects are used by the VFX crew much like Way of the Warrior.

Season 7 Episode 6 Treatery, Faith And The Great River:
Even the lowly Runabouts are shown to have shields that have been up-graded to defend against Dominion Phased Polaron Beams.

Deep Space Nine's VFX crews did not put shield flares in any large fleet action even if shields were being used, and commonly botched visuals when it came to ships. The reasons I've heard given range from lack of time and or money to just want it to "look cool".