Starfleet Jedi

Well, Star Trek Picard's "The Last Generation" not only delivered a nice send off to the TNG cast and crew, but it gave us our first look at Spacedock in action as it repelled a fleet of Borgified Starfleet vessels! Unlike the much smaller, less capable, and hastily upgraded Deep Space Nine, Earth Spacedock was able to sit for hours taking a pounding from what looks to be hundreds of ships and dishing it back. No wonder it wasn't seen during the first invasion of Sector 001: even the Borg cube didn't want to sit there wasting precious assimilation time slogging it out with that beast!

Also, this is a great in-the-face vindication for all the years of Warsies claiming Spacedock had no weapons, despite plenty of evidence to the contrary with the impressive firepower displayed by Deep Space Nine and references to defenses on other smaller starbases.

Although we got to see planetary shields before in Star Trek for even minor worlds under its jurisdiction, we get our first solid confirmation that Earth itself has them and they can tank hours of bombardment, which may give us some indication how long the Breen had to take and what they sacrificed in getting even a relatively small amount of damage leaked through them in DS9's "The Changing Face of Evil".

I still find it hilarious that, the longer new stuff from both Trek and Wars comes out, the more it seems both franchises are spitting in the faces of the Wongites/Saxtonites. Almost like karma for their horrible behavior all those years ago.

I'd be lying if I said I didn't want to see Star Wars get some boosts, though. Just so, ya know, the Debate could be somewhat reinvigorated. Bring back some of the fun times.

But I'll take this victory. Not complaining about THAT in the slightest.

The problem is that Star Trek always had things like individual ships that can devastate the surface of a planet, even with an advanced civilization with planetary defenses on it. As I noted in the OP, planetary shields existed. We knew that all the way back in TOS.

It's not been about that existing, it did. What the problem had always been is that Wongites (Saxtonites) went out of their way to deny it, even when the references and evidence were thrown right in their faces. When they couldn't deny the existence, they then went out of their way to downplay it while at the same time they grossly overestimated what Wars ships were capable of.

The Dominion must have thanked their lucky stars Spacedock wasn't the station guarding the wormhole.

Seeing as the original Spacedock One had been moved from Earth to Athan Prime to serve as the Fleet Museum, it's very lucky for the Dominion that Starfleet just didn't move one like it out there.

Mike DiCenso wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 22, 2023 4:56 pm

Seeing as the original Spacedock One had been moved from Earth to Athan Prime to serve as the Fleet Museum, it's very lucky for the Dominion that Starfleet just didn't move one like it out there.

Though that brings the question: why didn't it? If the wormhole was so important - and it was - why not set a Spacedock right at it?

Did they conclude that it couldn't be held anyway and that a Spacedock was too valuable to lose?

Good question. It may be that it just takes time to tow or otherwise gradually move one on its own out that far to the very frontiers of the Federation. And the other factor is that one may not have been available, and to take one away would've left someone somewhere defenseless. Very large starbases and Spacedock are strategic assets, so unless one is due for retirement and replacement, moving one from a critical planet or area of space is probably not a good idea because the risk is too high.

That being said, smaller ~1 km starbases, like 375, which was near Deep Space 9 and the Bajoran system, are probably what Starfleet can move around without causing too many issues and much more quickly than say, a Starbase 74 behemoth.

Mike DiCenso wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 21, 2023 9:59 pm

Good question. It may be that it just takes time to tow or otherwise gradually move one on its own out that far to the very frontiers of the Federation. And the other factor is that one may not have been available, and to take one away would've left someone somewhere defenseless. Very large starbases and Spacedock are strategic assets, so unless one is due for retirement and replacement, moving one from a critical planet or area of space is probably not a good idea because the risk is too high.

That being said, smaller ~1 km starbases, like 375, which was near Deep Space 9 and the Bajoran system, are probably what Starfleet can move around without causing too many issues and much more quickly than say, a Starbase 74 behemoth.

Maybe. It is just that I always assumed space stations simply had no warp capability. In fact, I think this is the first time we saw a starbase being relocated at interstellar distances in Star Trek?

Picard578 wrote: ↑

Fri Sep 22, 2023 9:06 pm

Mike DiCenso wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 21, 2023 9:59 pm

Good question. It may be that it just takes time to tow or otherwise gradually move one on its own out that far to the very frontiers of the Federation. And the other factor is that one may not have been available, and to take one away would've left someone somewhere defenseless. Very large starbases and Spacedock are strategic assets, so unless one is due for retirement and replacement, moving one from a critical planet or area of space is probably not a good idea because the risk is too high.

That being said, smaller ~1 km starbases, like 375, which was near Deep Space 9 and the Bajoran system, are probably what Starfleet can move around without causing too many issues and much more quickly than say, a Starbase 74 behemoth.

Maybe. It is just that I always assumed space stations simply had no warp capability. In fact, I think this is the first time we saw a starbase being relocated at interstellar distances in Star Trek?

There is another consideration. Given that space stations of this scale are massive strategic assets, moving them would be noticeable, so dragging one by tugs or whatever, would be very obvious. The Dominion noticed when major fleet elements left the front lines, so they'd know if a 14-18 km space station disappeared! The shields and weapons upgrades to Deep Space Nine itself were all done with the greatest of secrecy, even many Starfleet personnel didn't know it was being done! Which means that the Dominion and their allies had no idea what was going on and so had no way to sabotage or develop countermeasures to them.