Time travel

For polite and reasoned discussion of Star Wars and/or Star Trek.
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Who is like God arbour
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Post by Who is like God arbour » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:20 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:Is or is not Memory Alpha open to editing by anyone?
I don't know. I have never edited something on Memory Alpha. But even if it is, that still doesn't make it to Wikipedia.


Cpl Kendall wrote:My point which I have mentioned about three times by now, is that I do not care either way for the theory and only mentioned it so mojo would be aware of it.
And what exactly has that to do with the fact that I link to Memory Alpha or Wikipedia in my posts - or as you have insinuated - that I would use only these as sources?

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:26 pm

Who is like God arbour wrote:
I don't know. I have never edited something on Memory Alpha. But even if it is, that still doesn't make it to Wikipedia.
I just created an account on the site and as long as you have one you can edit any article you want.


Cpl Kendall wrote:
And what exactly has that to do with the fact that I link to Memory Alpha or Wikipedia in my posts - or as you have insinuated - that I would use only these as sources?
Nothing, I thought you were harping on the fact that I as pro-alternate timeline theory. And you don't have to keep linking to Memory Alpha, I get that it's there.

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l33telboi
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Post by l33telboi » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:35 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:I don't go to SB, with a few exceptions that place is populated with idiots.
It's only natural for someone to think that they and their kin are smarter then the ones they dislike. Human nature i suppose. I think opinions like that are rather naive though, and show a lack of rational thought.
And I never expressed support or disdain for the theory, I only mentioned it so mojo was aware of it. Which if you had read my previous post you would be aware of.
If you'd read my post, then you would've noticed that i took issue with you saying that "the vs. community" supports that theory. This is not true, as SB is at the moment probably the largest and most active board when it comes to vs. debating.

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:42 pm

l33telboi wrote:
It's only natural for someone to think that they and their kin are smarter then the ones they dislike. Human nature i suppose. I think opinions like that are rather naive though, and show a lack of rational thought.
Why thank you leet, you live up to all my expectations everytime you post.
If you'd read my post, then you would've noticed that i took issue with you saying that "the vs. community" supports that theory. This is not true, as SB is at the moment probably the largest and most active board when it comes to vs. debating.
Well bully for them, perhaps we should award them a medal....

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l33telboi
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Post by l33telboi » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:48 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:Why thank you leet, you live up to all my expectations everytime you post.

Well bully for them, perhaps we should award them a medal....
If you're going to keep on substituting real arguments and retorts for witty remarks that have nothing to do with the topic it at hand, i'm going to have to demand that they be wittier.

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Who is like God arbour
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Post by Who is like God arbour » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:55 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:I just created an account on the site and as long as you have one you can edit any article you want.
I haven't known that.

But I still doubt that you can write what you want.

Surly there are administators who would check each change and would prevent that somone can write rubbish.



And even if not. I usually have my own knowledge and only link to both sides for others.

Sometime I use these sides to confirm my memories or to see how I could phrase something in English.

But it is really seldom that I go to these side to search for totally new informations.

Insofar I'm convinced that I'm able to check the correctness of the sides I link to.

It gets only problematical when the sides are changed after I have linked to them.

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 6:20 pm

I suppose I could edit something and see if it gets changed back and how long it takes.

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Who is like God arbour
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Post by Who is like God arbour » Mon Aug 13, 2007 7:29 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:I suppose I could edit something and see if it gets changed back and how long it takes.
OK, please try to change the NCC number of the USS Enterprise (NCC-1701-E) in something hilarious.

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 7:32 pm

Who is like God arbour wrote: OK, please try to change the NCC number of the USS Enterprise (NCC-1701-E) in something hilarious.
That's too obvious and is guarantee'd to be changed back within minutes by another editor not to mention probably get me banned. We need to do something subtle, like change the entry for TWOK to say that the records on the Genesis device were erased by the staff.

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 7:43 pm

Edited the TWOK page.

Added the bolded line to this paragraph:
Kirk surveys the wounded in sickbay and attends Midshipman 1st Class Peter Preston on his deathbed. With impulse power restored, the Enterprise arrives at Regula I. Kirk assembles a landing party, and Saavik reminds him of General Order 15. They find the station's crew killed, and discover Chekov and Terrell inside a storage compartment. They find that the stations records of the Genesis Device have been erased by the Regula staff. Exploring the station leads them to a transporter that has recently been activated. Checking the coordinates, Kirk realizes they beamed into the Regula asteroid. Kirk asks for a damage report from Enterprise. Spock reports that "by the book, hours would seem like days" and that transporters will be available in two days.

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Who is like God arbour
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Post by Who is like God arbour » Mon Aug 13, 2007 7:56 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:That's too obvious and is guarantee'd to be changed back within minutes by another editor not to mention probably get me banned. We need to do something subtle, like change the entry for TWOK to say that the records on the Genesis device were erased by the staff.
That's too inconspicuous - and even true according to the novel.

I know the movie.

But if I would read the summary of Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan on Memory Alpha and there would be written that the records of the Genesis device were erased by the staff, I wouldn't notice it if it wouldn't be exactly what I would search for.

But if I would search for such detailed informations, my main source would be my own DVD or the novel, followed by the script - but not Memory Alpha.

Such mistake could only be noticed if the administators really are checking each change - and if you really only would change that.

If you would write a whole new summary - and only that little information would be false, the administrator surly wouldn't notice it.

But it would be interssting to test all three possibilities.
  1. an obvious mistake,
  2. a small change consisting only of a mistake and
  3. a huge change with one little mistake while all the other parts - in which the mistake would be inconspicuous - are correct.
Last edited by Who is like God arbour on Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:03 pm

Well lets see how this plays out, if the people on Memory Alpha are as anal as those on Wikipedia or Conservapedia this shouldn't be up for very long.

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Post by Socar » Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:32 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:Well lets see how this plays out, if the people on Memory Alpha are as anal as those on Wikipedia or Conservapedia this shouldn't be up for very long.
You think Conservapedia is bad? You should check out CreationWiki. The people on there complain that Conservapedia is "too liberal". Hahaha.

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Post by Cpl Kendall » Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:34 pm

Socar wrote:
You think Conservapedia is bad? You should check out CreationWiki. The people on there complain that Conservapedia is "too liberal". Hahaha.
Oh good crap, a creationist wiki. That's got to be a real treat.

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Re: Time travel

Post by Mike DiCenso » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:54 pm

Mr. Oragahn wrote:
Admiral Naismith wrote:I’m rather new to this debate but there is one big factor that I have not seen covered, and that is time travel.
The Feds have shown that they have controlled time travel(st: iv). I admit that spock is a genius even by Starfleet standards but surely they have figured it out by TNG era.

This would give the Feds a significant edge if they chose to use it.
In the movies the empire does not show the ability to travel through time (I think if they had it they would use it to save the Death Star.)
I’m wondering do they have it in the EU.
Dude, you get extra points for the sheer coolness of bearing Miles' Dendarii grade!

As far as time travel, obviously, in that whale probe film, it didn't took much for Kirk and co to both decide to go back in time, and actually do it.

You wonder why it's not used much more, notably by all the enemies of the Federation.
It's just the most convenient plot excuse to be used, and in all fairness, I hate time travel.

Sometimes, time travel is regulated. Sometimes, it's not.

Because it would lead to more and more attempts at each side of the temporal war trying to set things right, and or trying to eliminate the side of the conflict that tried to snuff them out, or both, ect.

Really complicated stuff. This is also presumably what the starting basis for the Temporal Cold War that is shown and referenced to numerous times throughout three of the four seasons of ST:Enterprise.

In the case of the Federation versus the Galactic Empire, the Federation may chose to use time travel, since any contact between the SW galaxy and the events seen the in the OT and PT and the Milky Way galaxy requires a form of time travel in and of itself, and therefore prolonged contact with the SW galaxy would be a temporal violation as it would have a potentially profound inpact on the SW galaxy's future.
-Mike

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