Star Trek: Discovery

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359
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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by 359 » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:45 am

I had a number of issues with the first episode, primary of which was Michael. I don't have an issue with people being flawed, even majorly so. But in my opinion there was no established motive or background for her actions, making it feel very forced and just like "okay, so this is what starfleet officers do." And I have no problem with officers "betraying their uniform," to borrow a phrase from DS9, see TNG: "The Wounded" with captain Maxwell as an example, but this felt like something else entirely.

More aesthetically, I was constantly irritated by the obvious fan service, at least that's what it seemed like, when they'd throw in random prominent sound effects from previous series' at random times while on the bridge. That plus the over-the top technobabble inserted at times for the sake of saying: 'look, we do like Trek!'. And I know they were going for a more relaxed, familiar crew during ship operations, but I constantly felt like the characters just didn't care about what they were doing instead of simply being chatty and friendly. Amid a slew of other minor gripes is what I felt was some shoddy cinematography with conversations making jump cuts for seemingly no reason, just to land in the exact same conversation, at the same point, but in a different place; such as when they were discussing the "object of unknown origin," bridge -> telescope -> ready room. No breaks in conversation, no discernible passage of time, simply jumped to a new room with the same characters standing about in a different fashion.


Now the second episode was a different beast all together. I thought it was well directed and played off the characters personalities well, particularly in contrast to the jumble that was EP 1. It established a solid plot and followed a distinct progression of events, characters namely the officers on the Shenzhou, moved with more enthusiasm and clearly cared about what was happening and about each other, and it played well off of Michael's fallen status. And I'll admit to getting a swelling feeling of enthusiasm when the USS Europa arrived and rescued the Shenzhou. I would definitely say that the second episode was not simply better than the first, but it was actually good.

Although I was not impressed by the season teaser at the end, I got too much of a USS Pegasus + newBSG feel from what was going on. But that all remains to be discovered... heh. But I will say the USS Discovery is beyond hideous, like Darth Hideous. I don't know what they were thinking, the thing looks like a garbage scow and should be hauled out as garbage.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by 2046 » Sun Oct 01, 2017 6:13 pm

Of concern is how badly written it was, which really only hits you in rewatch.

1. It was all exposition, all the time, with characters talking about their relationships and such as if they knew a clueless audience was listening, but not as people who actually lived the experiences. Seriously, Saru (great acting, mind you) never told Burnham about the Kelpians? Bridge sarcasm only now gets a response from Burnham? The captain needed to be told of the reason for the walk to the well minutes from?

They literally took years to make this. The writing should've been better than Axanar.

2. The plot and motivations made no sense. The stretch-skulled quadri-nostrilled be-clawed hairless Klingons had some logic in broad strokes (but a single battle makes someone Unforgettable now?), but Captain G totally forces the battle in her hail, and Burnham's logic behind firing first is utterly ridiculous. It would be like sending small warships to Japan next time you want to negotiate a trade agreement because it totally worked 150 years ago.

3. Why the hell did they change out of their cloth uniforms? They beam over with bright blue lights shining on their guns so stealth wasn't it, and obviously the material doesn't do squat against sharps. And, Burnham switching to kill was completely stupid, both in the moment and broadly.


This scratches the surface of the problems, but I could literally take apart this obvious reboot scene-by-scene.

At least they seem to aim for cute redheads in casting. Each ship apparently gets one.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by Mike DiCenso » Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:23 am

I see this is quickly getting into the realm of review/criticism and so any more such posts should be done over in that forum.
-Mike

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Tue Oct 03, 2017 4:52 pm

1. Is there an explanation as to why a woman is called Michael or is it just some kind of feminist HA! thing, forced and gratuitous?

2. So the USS discovery has an empty rim that cuts the saucer into two concentric sections because... ? With nacelles, you could perhaps have a good excuse (radiations, cooling, I don't know) but here, aside from just making the ship weaker, what's the purpose? Is it going to... transform??

3. The Shenzhou looks nice, especially from below (has too many windows on the saucer's top side). It's actually a clever evolution from the coaster-dorito-two-sausages initial sketch and it really feels like Starfleet created the entire class out of an hybrid of a Klingon ship they would have scavanged and some Starfleet guidelines. The nacelles barely show any glowiness. The pink-neon ring at the front looks totally retarded though. Don't tell me this is supposed to work like some kind of antenna/dish. The central section of the saucer that runs from front to tail looks like it's been borrowed from both nuBSG civilian ships and the Mass Effect's Normandy.

4. The USS Europa is such pile of angry polygons in places.

Overall, in terms of designs, the blockiness and weird templates of old are replaced by MAXIMUM SLEEKNESS and METALLIC PANCAKES in lieu of saucers.
Also, a quick look at the other ships of the BotBS (eh...) reveals that all ship designs have largely ditched any attempt to somehow feel connected to the old Trek or even anything that would look like the Enterprise-refit version. It's all super agressive.
Not sure designs could change so radically for designs which are not commercial (we're not talking about cars here).

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by Mike DiCenso » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:14 am

The answer to your first question is "yes", it can be a girls name, though it is not a popular one.

Second, the USS Discovery, if you've seen "Context is for Kings", is a brand-new, experimental ship.

- From a Versus standpoint, there's a great scene in Discovery's sister ship's engineering room where a phaser rifle is used in beam mode to cut through a door so our heroes can escape, the look is visual stunning as the beam makes the door glow and then melt quite quickly.

Also, the Shenzhou is stated to be a very old ship, hence the weird transporters and the NX-class style features.

Third, if you'd seen the aforementioned episode, you'd have spotted dozens of design choices that call back to the TOS look, but have updated it. The new engineering room/lab set is one example and in the ship's mess hall, there are food processor doors very much like those in the TOS Enterprise's mess hall and recreation room.
-Mike

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by 2046 » Sat Oct 07, 2017 3:00 am

The ships are Eavesian angular messes. There's a vessel in the battle that looks like a sister ship to the Sovereign, for crying out loud. No lineage concept at all. Indeed, I don't even know what "NX features" the Shen has.

Also, if the "new" ship is 1031 (the sister ship supposedly being 1030) and the old bucket is 1227, it seems they have also rebooted registry logic along with ship design.

What a waste.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by Iscander » Sat Oct 14, 2017 2:25 am

Not sure if I like it or not but at least there is a 'reason' for the hula hoop saucer on Discovery.

The outer ring spins up when the ship uses the spore drive so there's that.
Last edited by Iscander on Sun Oct 15, 2017 2:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by Iscander » Sat Oct 14, 2017 2:49 pm

Oh Memory Alpha, is there any random factoid you don't hold.

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/B-24-CLN

http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/seaso ... hd-192.jpg

So it looks like the Discovery style hull has actually made it on screen before. I knew it was based on an old design for the Enterprise but did not know it was ever used.

2046 wrote:Also, if the "new" ship is 1031 (the sister ship supposedly being 1030) and the old bucket is 1227, it seems they have also rebooted registry logic along with ship design.
Well since the 1701 Enterprise should be up and running by now...

It may be unsatisfying, but there are some possibilities based on canon and the real world.

The Discovery and Glenn could have been commissioned well before they were launched with the Shenzou and Enterprise commissioned after but completed before. Budget reasons or the department that ordered them taking a long lead time on finishing the design have been know to cause this IRL.

There is also the Motion picture treatment of the Enterprise, where a ship decades old is stripped to the frame and rebuilt. Brand new out of spacedock, but with a much older hull number. This might make more sense with the addition of the Spore Drive. If the ship wasn't built around the spore drive but had to be rebuilt for the project, to include the test chambers, and especially the rotating saucer module.

On a real world note. Producers need to stop just picking hull numbers at random.

From Memory Alpha...
Background information

Bryan Fuller chose the Discovery's registry number, 1031, because he loves Halloween. [1] Several fans have speculated that it may also point to Section 31 involvement, however.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by 2046 » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:29 am

As I reacted on Twitter to the rotating hulls, "What the frak is this gagh-frass?"

Link to gif of it: https://mobile.twitter.com/TrekCore/sta ... 25/photo/1

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:57 pm

Mushrooms and warp? The trippy drive, flying through outer space at stoner speed? Wooooo bro... USS Weedy is comin'

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