Atheism in the UFP

[Mr. Oragahn]

Damn, 2046, Darth Spock ad Cocytus, your views of the universe are quite depressing:
There's no point to any of this!
Such a lack of any explanation and none coming!
It's all a mistake!
We must be so boooring!
A perfect system wouldn't allow any choice!
Etc.
Really? :|









































































PLEASE LET ME DIE!!

:( :( :( :(































































:)
.

[2046]

Me? What did I do?

Even if the existence of the universe itself is a fairly well-known "how" after a few moments into it but an unanswered "why", the rise of biochemical life within it is all readily understandable, and then it's a hop, skip, and jump to beings capable of reason, meaning, and beauty.

Or, take the brilliantly-simple advice a remarkably lovely Ukrainian exchange student I once knew gave when asked what the purpose of life was outside a Judeo-Christian context: "just live".

[Mr. Oragahn]

Me? What did I do?

Even if the existence of the universe itself is a fairly well-known "how" after a few moments into it but an unanswered "why", the rise of biochemical life within it is all readily understandable, and then it's a hop, skip, and jump to beings capable of reason, meaning, and beauty.

Or, take the brilliantly-simple advice a remarkably lovely Ukrainian exchange student I once knew gave when asked what the purpose of life was outside a Judeo-Christian context: "just live".

It's perhaps a good start, yes, but certainly not a satisfying end.
Many people on this planet just live and their existence seems hardly remarkable.
Now hold on, here I go quotin'...

I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

[Sandyin]

All in all, I think I got my answers regarding my initial query.

Sorry if I'm being dense but I really am at a loss as to what your initial query was and what answer you've arrived at.

[Mr. Oragahn]

All in all, I think I got my answers regarding my initial query.

Sorry if I'm being dense but I really am at a loss as to what your initial query was and what answer you've arrived at.

What matters most isn't the destination but the journey.

:P

[Sandyin]

All in all, I think I got my answers regarding my initial query.

Sorry if I'm being dense but I really am at a loss as to what your initial query was and what answer you've arrived at.

What matters most isn't the destination but the journey.

:P

And the award for most evasive non-answer goes to...

[dramatic drum roll]

Mr. Oragahn! Congratulations! Johnny, tell him what he's won!

[sonofccn]

Or, take the brilliantly-simple advice a remarkably lovely Ukrainian exchange student I once knew gave when asked what the purpose of life was outside a Judeo-Christian context: "just live".

Please forgive my intruding, maybe I'm just being dense as I usually am,but I'm unsure what "just live" means in this context as a life philosophy. I guess what I'm asking is hypothetically were I to follow this path what values or morals would I strive to fulfil/uphold to live a worthy life compared to the Judeo-Christian context.

-Respectfully, Sonofccn

[2046]

That wasn't a normative statement of ethics, it was a sweeping answer to questions like "why go on?" of the type that Oragahn suggested.

As for reality-based ethics, I favor Rand.

[sonofccn]

That wasn't a normative statement of ethics, it was a sweeping answer to questions like "why go on?" of the type that Oragahn suggested.

As for reality-based ethics, I favor Rand.

Ah. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

For whatever it’s worth for me I would argue the question of “why go on?” is inescapably intertwined with ones values and ethics. That only by upholding and affirming ones principals, whatever values those might be and by whatever metric you chose to measure by, can one’s life be fulfilled and content.

In any event I thank you for your time and trouble as well as indulging me with a response.

-Respectfully, Sonofccn

[2046]

The simplicity of "just live" is almost matched by another answer to the same question: "why not?"

Assigning matters of values and ethics to the question is not altogether improper, but seems unnecessary on a most basic level. I'm reminded of Captain Kirk's classic "I will not kill, today!" . . . it's a simple binary thing. 1 or 0, something's almost invariably better than nothing, et cetera.

Now, what you do with all the idle time you'll have when you've chosen to live . . . that's where values and ethics come into play.

[sonofccn]

The simplicity of "just live" is almost matched by another answer to the same question: "why not?"

Assigning matters of values and ethics to the question is not altogether improper, but seems unnecessary on a most basic level. I'm reminded of Captain Kirk's classic "I will not kill, today!" . . . it's a simple binary thing. 1 or 0, something's almost invariably better than nothing, et cetera.

Now, what you do with all the idle time you'll have when you've chosen to live . . . that's where values and ethics come into play.

It certainly is an attractive proposition and as a proud "good old boy" I certainly don't like to complicate that which should be simple.

My reservation however is, I would argue, that humanity, being fragile, short lived creatures, have an intrinsic yearning for some lasting accomplishment or otherwise touch some sliver of immortality. Existence for existence sake, for me, seems an inadequate purpose or answer. I would argue that ultimately one, consciously or unconsciously, one would be compelled to find another greater, more encompassing one.

Indeed I submit that many of the horrors of the 20th century were if not started at least fueled by the people seeking order, purpose and meaning in a world bereft of the old dogmas. Seeking something larger than themselves whether it was the State, Race or a Demagogue.

As an alternative I offer that if you lived well, if you lived a life you would be proud to justify to God, Q or whatever else awaits us, and propagated said values to the next generation completing the circle that that is a worthy, lasting purpose.

Or that's my thought at least such as I have thoughts on such heady matters.

-Respectfully, Sonofccn

[2046]

I agree on all counts, and suspect that there may have been a lack of clarity in my retelling the Ukrainian hottie's point. "Just live" is the why, not the how. In other words, "why go on?" is thus answered by "shut up and keep breathing." There was no normative concept at play beyond that.

[sonofccn]

I agree on all counts, and suspect that there may have been a lack of clarity in my retelling the Ukrainian hottie's point. "Just live" is the why, not the how. In other words, "why go on?" is thus answered by "shut up and keep breathing." There was no normative concept at play beyond that.

If there has been any misunderstanding it is entirely my fault and I most heartfeltly apologize.

My interpretation was that one should focus on living ones life rather than useless navel gazing and I did not mean to imply or suggest you were advocating a particular ideology or set of beliefs.

Again if I am just being dense and missing your clear point please accept my humble apology for the error.

Finally I wish to thank you for the honor and privilege it has been to have a discussion with you.

-Respectfully, Sonofccn

[2046]

The honor is mine, sir. I am just a cranky old bastard on the 'tubes. You, meanwhile, have elevated the already-delightful discussion.

Given certain recent discussions of a lower caliber I participated in elsewhere, it has been refreshing.

[Moff Tarquin]

Because believing anything to be true based only on faith is foolish. You can't prove anything based on faith, but faith is often the justification given for believing in things religious. I had always imagined that people in the Federation were very well educated, and would be skeptical of beliefs or "truths" for which there is no evidence.

This question might seem a bit odd at first, but it will make sense a couple of exchanges from now: are you human?