Interphasic Cloak

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:17 am

enigma wrote:So at least in Trek then, they can stay phased as long as the ship's life support functions.

You don't get it do you? The point is that that were not completely out of phase in either example or otherwise they would have suffocated regardless of life support or not since they simply would have not been able to breathe unphased air!

enigma · Post by **enigma** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:17 am

Also, upon looking through the SDN thread on the matter and I agree that overall it is useless. It'll only be a matter of time before the opposing side to counter it and\or even develop one of their own. Plus regular cloaks do a pretty good job on their own even in battle. I mean if you want to bombard a planet but an opposing fleet is in your way then go around them. You are not stuck in a 2D universe.

Once used, it'll only be a matter time time from seconds to a few years that detection\counter measure is developed.

But I do see some in it as a first strike option. Hit'em hard with automated shuttles loaded with armed quantum torpedos and detonate them once they are inside the enemy's ships\starbases. :)

But you need to hit them hard and fast as to not let them get a word out or else they'll know what you have.

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:21 am

enigma wrote: It'll only be a matter of time before the opposing side to counter it and\or even develop one of their own. Plus regular cloaks do a pretty good job on their own even in battle. I mean if you want to bombard a planet but an opposing fleet is in your way then go around them. You are not stuck in a 2D universe.

Once used, it'll only be a matter time time from seconds to a few years that detection\counter measure is developed.

But I do see some in it as a first strike option. Hit'em hard with automated shuttles loaded with armed quantum torpedos and detonate them once they are inside the enemy's ships\starbases. :)

But you need to hit them hard and fast as to not let them get a word out or else they'll know what you have.

I very much doubt anybody could come with a countermeasure in seconds against something of this nature, now a few years is quite possible but seconds? Who are you kidding?

enigma · Post by **enigma** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:38 am

PunkMaister wrote:
enigma wrote: It'll only be a matter of time before the opposing side to counter it and\or even develop one of their own. Plus regular cloaks do a pretty good job on their own even in battle. I mean if you want to bombard a planet but an opposing fleet is in your way then go around them. You are not stuck in a 2D universe.

Once used, it'll only be a matter time time from seconds to a few years that detection\counter measure is developed.

But I do see some in it as a first strike option. Hit'em hard with automated shuttles loaded with armed quantum torpedos and detonate them once they are inside the enemy's ships\starbases. :)

But you need to hit them hard and fast as to not let them get a word out or else they'll know what you have.
I very much doubt anybody could come with a countermeasure in seconds against something of this nature, now a few years is quite possible but seconds? Who are you kidding?

All it takes is a Captain to ask if they can track it down. The reply might be that they are out of phase and if the captain is smart he\she will reply, "Can we adjust the sensors to their phased frequency (treknobabble)?" The reply might end up as a yes.

The Feds have a knack or adjusting sensors and deflector shields for many reasons. :)

Post by **Jedi Master Spock** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:53 am

enigma wrote:Also, upon looking through the SDN thread on the matter and I agree that overall it is useless. It'll only be a matter of time before the opposing side to counter it and\or even develop one of their own. Plus regular cloaks do a pretty good job on their own even in battle. I mean if you want to bombard a planet but an opposing fleet is in your way then go around them. You are not stuck in a 2D universe.

Once used, it'll only be a matter time time from seconds to a few years that detection\counter measure is developed.

Sure, there will be countermeasures developed. However, until that time, the phase cloak represents the pinnacle of cloaking technology, and remains still useful even after other people figure out how to detect it all the time (presuming it's ever possible to do that continuously) - and not just against the numerous factions that you have yet to encounter before.

Really, remember those hard-to-navigate asteroid fields of "Genesis" and "The Empire Strikes Back"? Completely irrelevant obstacles. Hazardous natural phenomena? Most of them won't be in your phase.

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:54 am

enigma wrote:All it takes is a Captain to ask if they can track it down. The reply might be that they are out of phase and if the captain is smart he\she will reply, "Can we adjust the sensors to their phased frequency (treknobabble)?" The reply might end up as a yes.

The Feds have a knack or adjusting sensors and deflector shields for many reasons. :)

Even if they could track then what good would it do since they are out of phase with solid matter they cannot touch them regardless?

Who is like God arbour · Post by **Who is like God arbour** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 6:43 am

enigma wrote:Also, upon looking through the SDN thread on the matter and I agree that overall it is useless. It'll only be a matter of time before the opposing side to counter it and\or even develop one of their own. Plus regular cloaks do a pretty good job on their own even in battle. I mean if you want to bombard a planet but an opposing fleet is in your way then go around them. You are not stuck in a 2D universe.

Once used, it'll only be a matter time time from seconds to a few years that detection\counter measure is developed.

enigma wrote:All it takes is a Captain to ask if they can track it down. The reply might be that they are out of phase and if the captain is smart he\she will reply, "Can we adjust the sensors to their phased frequency (treknobabble)?" The reply might end up as a yes.

The Feds have a knack or adjusting sensors and deflector shields for many reasons. :)

Only because in the past, a countermeasure was developed in most cases, we can not assume, that also in the future a countermeasure can always be developed.
It is possible, that there is a limit to the possibilities of developing countermeasures. If it is, for example, only possible to detect a phased cloaked ship, if you have its phase variance, but exactly that is unknown and there is an infinite number of possible variances, it may be impossible or highly improbable that one can detect a phase cloaked ship.

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 3:16 pm

Also, in the case of SW vs ST, when has the Empire demonstrated that kind of versatility?
When have they demonstrated innovation?

All they've ever demonstrated is the capability and willingness to make things bigger.
The DS is nothing more then a humongous SPHAT-T cannon, and an ISD is nothing more then a bigger Venator.

Their hand weapons are exactly the same in firepower and work in exactly the same way in the OT as in the PT.

So they're capacity to effectively find ways to detect and counter such a cloak is severely limited, AFAIK.

Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:57 pm

enigma wrote: As for the ISD, using the IC would not guarantee that they'd be able to enter the ship as (as far as I know) it has shielding that is interdimensional in nature. So, you might just bounce off them thus announcing yourself. :)

Assuming you were correct about the shielding, how would it being interdimensional stop something that exists in the same dimension as you, but is out of phase?
-Mike

Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 4:09 pm

enigma wrote: Plus regular cloaks do a pretty good job on their own even in battle. I mean if you want to bombard a planet but an opposing fleet is in your way then go around them. You are not stuck in a 2D universe.

Regular cloaking devices do not remove you out of phase and therefore you still are subject to being bombarded, if the enemy realizes you're out there (See "Balance of Terror" and "Redemption, Part II for examples of this). On the other hand, being phased you can more likely avoid detection, and if some thinks you're out there, being fired at by pulse phasers or torpedoes on proximity blast won't harm you.

Go around? So the opposing fleet is just going to sit there twiddling it's thumbs while you attempt to go around them. If you can move, they can too. Also what about "going around" planetary defenses, like those at Chintoka? Or what if there is a combined fleet and planetary defenses deployed in a great big "cloud" around the target planet, like we saw in DS9's "What You Leave Behind"? With a phase cloak, you just go right on through, staying out of phase while you launch your moded torpedoes at the planet and then turn around and toast the defensive fleet, plus the orbital weapons platforms and space stations.
-Mike