Jedi Master Spock, post your education credentials

[GStone]

Well, that'll depend on whether you can actually 'prove' you've got that degree and that you do work at that company. Come on, post all your personal info online. You'll be able to remove it after a thorough analysis, ike getting rid of piss from a swimming pool.

[searches around]

Where is that spare internet burner?

[Praeothmin]

Well, since I like my privacy, I'll just keep on not really caring whether people believe me or not... :)

[Opecoiler]

snip

Quit trying to evade, and quit trying to come up with excuses as to why you shouldn't post them.

I asked you for your credentials. Please post them. It's a simple request.

[Jedi Master Spock]

Quit trying to evade, and quit trying to come up with excuses as to why you shouldn't post them.

Those are perfectly good logical reasons for maintaining my privacy - above and beyond my personal love of privacy and my belief in neutral, anonymous, and above all civilized discourse.

I asked you for your credentials. Please post them. It's a simple request.

And "no" is a simple answer.

[Opecoiler]

Those are perfectly good logical reasons for maintaining my privacy - above and beyond my personal love of privacy and my belief in neutral, anonymous, and above all civilized discourse.

This is making me lean more and more towards believing that you don't have any education past the high school level. Someone who really had a college education wouldn't hesitate to say it. It's something to be proud of, a degree.

Instead, you're squirming, and falling back on your love of "Civilized" discourse. Being polite and civilized doesn't make you any more honest, truthful, or even likeable. You will gain more respect if you show your full credentials honestly, and you have so little respect at SD.net right now that it can only go up.

And "no" is a simple answer.

All right. Then we'll just have to assume that you're an uneducated little kid. Which actually makes sense, given your ridiculous claims (Several hours to Endor, diesel fusion, that the Smuggler's Moon was very small just because of population), and your case of Black Knight Syndrome (Still believing that you were winning after being constantly pounded over dozens of pages by multiple users).

[Jedi Master Spock]

This is making me lean more and more towards believing that you don't have any education past the high school level. Someone who really had a college education wouldn't hesitate to say it.

Actually, given the circumstances, I sincerely believe most would hesitate - and then decide that discretion is the wiser choice.

Do you really think that most people want complete strangers on a website with a reputation for uncouth behavior poring over their personal information?

You can either take me at face value when I say things like this:

In any event, those with formal educations - such as myself, Schneider, Kennedy, Wong, or Saxton - should know better than to claim that a formal education can turn you into an authority on Star Trek or Star Wars.

Or you can think that I'm lying. As I explained quite directly on ST.com, it's trivially easy to fake credentials, and is next to impossible to verify actual competence in a field.

You will gain more respect if you show your full credentials honestly, and you have so little respect at SD.net right now that it can only go up.

I don't care much what SDN thinks collectively as a community.

Which actually makes sense, given your ridiculous claims (Several hours to Endor,

Required by the G canon - as much as any trip is - and confirmed in detail as to its ready possibility by the EU.

diesel fusion,

This is, by the way, still the only hypothesis which explains why in Star Wars, you mine gas giants; why Star Wars fuel looks and acts the way it does; why the energy of an exploding Star Wars ship is of a chemical order; et cetera. I am perfectly willing to debate this point for point; the simple fact is that diesel fusion is the most elegant explanation for Lucas's choice of using familiar visual and practical treatments (clear, explosive, aromatic fuel of not too great density).

Now. Is it actually official? Of course not. It's simply the most scientifically elegant explanation of the film level evidence that you're going to get. Is it going to explain everything in the entire EU? I refer you to what I jokingly coined "Gödel's incompleteness theorem for fanalysis." No coherent explanation will - mine or Saxton's.

Does it explain the Death Star? No. The Death Star has characteristics entirely different from those described above, from its highly energetic destruction to its unique reactor.

that the Smuggler's Moon was very small just because of population),

A very good conclusion.

Did you miss, incidentally, the part where I went into precisely how little energy is actually required to cause a city-world to collapse?

Or the part where even Point 45 conceded that he had been at least partially wrong about warp speed, increasing his claims by a full order of magnitude?

Or would you like to discuss, instead, why Lucas chooses to give us a pseudo-planetary environment inside an asteroid too small to have a gravitational field of any magnitude? Star Wars is not hard science fiction.

Or perhaps you would like to explain why SDN, supposedly full of technically educated people, can't seem to grasp how conservation of energy requires something on the order of hundreds of exawatts for Federation starship warp cores? From the replies I got on ST.com, those arguing with me there found that every bit as difficult to believe as anything I've said about ST.com - and didn't understand the basic argument at all.

and your case of Black Knight Syndrome (Still believing that you were winning after being constantly pounded over dozens of pages by multiple users).

After being fruitlessly attacked by numerous users, you mean?

I recommend you go back and read carefully. Were there any users not part of the "SDN crowd" that were going through the thread and finding themselves convinced by either myself or the SDN crowd? If so, which did they find more convincing? Them, or me?

Once you have answered that question, you may start considering the question of who was "winning" or "losing" in any sense of the word.

However, if you want to address any of this, I'm going to recommend a new topic.

[Cock_Knocker]

For the first part, fine, I don't care.

Yet you were the one to bring the question up...

For the second part, that's a very cheap baiting you've tried there.

Yes, and "Geez. You could start by asking Poe's qualifications." wasn't.

You can still check the two or three threads dealing with your own pages in the "outer website" forum section.

And as I've said before, I stand by everything on those pages. Frankly, a group that actually believes it took the Rebel fleet 8 hours from hyperspace exit to get to Endor doesn't exactly have the most rational thought processes, in my view.

[Cock_Knocker]

And since I have a full-fledged degree in Electronics, and work in an optics company, I guess I can therefore, according to Mr. Wong's way of thinking, declare that anything you say has no value in the SW vs ST debate, since you have no scientific qualifications.
See, it goes both ways...

Hi Strawman!

See, you'd be correct if I put up a completely misinformed post about oh, say, "watts and joules are interchangeable". But objective observation is another matter. For instance, stating Worf would wipe the floor with a Jedi hand to hand after seeing multiple instances of Captain Kirk and Major Kira kick the crap out of armed Klingons, is simply a symptom of an idiotic thought process, no matter how many degrees said idiot holds.

[Mr. Oragahn]

For the first part, fine, I don't care.

Yet you were the one to bring the question up...

Yep. Considering that you are the author of some SW pages and still active, for a simple concern of parity, as SDN thinks it's ok to ask for JSM's background, so would you.
Still, it doesn't mean I personnaly care, no that I'd even bother verifying if it's true.
What matters is what you say.

For the second part, that's a very cheap baiting you've tried there.

Yes, and "Geez. You could start by asking Poe's qualifications." wasn't.

Well, you know, I'm just applying your rules.

You can still check the two or three threads dealing with your own pages in the "outer website" forum section.

And as I've said before, I stand by everything on those pages. Frankly, a group that actually believes it took the Rebel fleet 8 hours from hyperspace exit to get to Endor doesn't exactly have the most rational thought processes, in my view.

That's nothing more than handwaving with a terrible excuse. Not counting the banding fallacy.

[Who is like God arbour]

I've yet to see Wong make any comment about the rampant nonsense Poe has been posting in the "more trektardism" thread.

Probably because I'm making sense. In which case, you'd be hard pressed to understand my posts.

[...]


And as I've said before, I stand by everything on those pages. [...]

As much sense as your video »Happy / Crappy Landings«, which is debated here. As some SDN members like he who participated as Point_45 at STARTREK.COM, would say, the fact that you don't defend your video further shows that you have conceeded that your video is wrong. In my opinion, it does not make sense.

And "no" is a simple answer.

All right. Then we'll just have to assume that you're an uneducated little kid. Which actually makes sense, given your ridiculous claims (Several hours to Endor, diesel fusion, that the Smuggler's Moon was very small just because of population), and your case of Black Knight Syndrome (Still believing that you were winning after being constantly pounded over dozens of pages by multiple users).

Please explain, how in that points, you have listed, a engineer degree would be helpfull.

• I haven't known, that the analysis of film footage or novels is taught in any science studies.
• What use could a science degree have in the question, how long the journey from Sullust to Endor has lasted?
• Why would someone with a science degree be better qualified to answer the question, if the pilots of fighters could have lowered or deactivated their artificial gravity. Artificial gravitiy is not taught in any science studies.
• Why would someone with a science degree be better qualified to answer the question, how fast hyper-space travel is?
• Why would someone with a science degree be better qualified to answer the question, if there is a time dilation in hyperspace?
  
  Hyper-space physic is not taught in science studies. Fact is, that we have no clue, what exactly haperspace is. It is nothing more than technobabble. That question can be answered only by the analysis of film footage or novels but not with science.

[Who is like God arbour]

You never really checked out SFJ, did you. They DO think Trek is the only worthwhile SciFi there is to begin with.

My latest dumpster dive here.

Mr. Oragahn: "Waaa! Why don't they ask for Poe's credentials? Waa!"

Poe provides them.

Mr. Oragahn: "Waaa! I didn't care anyway! And you're baiting me, you big meanie! Waa!"

Having credentials doesn't prove one right, but lack there-of isn't exactly a good sign. If they had credentials, they'd know that.

Hi Strawman!

See, you'd be correct if I put up a completely misinformed post about oh, say, "watts and joules are interchangeable". But objective observation is another matter. For instance, stating Worf would wipe the floor with a Jedi hand to hand after seeing multiple instances of Captain Kirk and Major Kira kick the crap out of armed Klingons, is simply a symptom of an idiotic thought process, no matter how many degrees said idiot holds.

And then,

"Who Is Like The Pimple On Everyone's Ass": "Waa! You stopped defending your "Happy/Crappy Landing Video", so YOU'RE the doodie-head! Waa!"

Yes, because after demolishing every criticism he had of that video twice, (and proving he cherry picks bits and pieces out of the canon and ignored the rest) I didn't return for several more endless rounds of,"Nuh uh!".

At SDN, they would say, that you are a lying little dipshit. You are contorting what Mr. Oragahn has said and what I have said and are lying about your "demolishing every criticism". You have not contradicted the arguments, I and others have brought forward. You simply haven't responded after your second post anymore.

But here, at SFJ, we wouldn't say such a thing.

But now, I challenge you to continue the thread »Happy / Crappy Landings«.
Defend yourself!

[GStone]

And since I have a full-fledged degree in Electronics, and work in an optics company, I guess I can therefore, according to Mr. Wong's way of thinking, declare that anything you say has no value in the SW vs ST debate, since you have no scientific qualifications.
See, it goes both ways...

Hi Strawman!

See, you'd be correct if I put up a completely misinformed post about oh, say, "watts and joules are interchangeable". But objective observation is another matter. For instance, stating Worf would wipe the floor with a Jedi hand to hand after seeing multiple instances of Captain Kirk and Major Kira kick the crap out of armed Klingons, is simply a symptom of an idiotic thought process, no matter how many degrees said idiot holds.

You say it's an idiotic thought process, yet you will say that because generic klingons 243-541 have been bested by a bajoran and a human, they supposedly have equal skill to one specific character and then say a generic jedi would be able to beat Worf (despite the fact we've seen him win an interstellar championship- winning 'Champion Standing'). That's like saying any randomly choosen person from the US military would have the skill of Bruce Lee because both are human and both have had self-defense/martial arts/weapons training.

That's crazy.

[Opecoiler]

Actually, given the circumstances, I sincerely believe most would hesitate - and then decide that discretion is the wiser choice.

Do you really think that most people want complete strangers on a website with a reputation for uncouth behavior poring over their personal information?

You can either take me at face value when I say things like this:

In any event, those with formal educations - such as myself, Schneider, Kennedy, Wong, or Saxton - should know better than to claim that a formal education can turn you into an authority on Star Trek or Star Wars.

Or you can think that I'm lying. As I explained quite directly on ST.com, it's trivially easy to fake credentials, and is next to impossible to verify actual competence in a field.

More dodging, more trying to do anything but give your credentials-especially since you've made the claim that your board seems more educated than him without giving any real proof. That claim is especially doubtful given that at least one of your members said that google was better than a formal education.

Do you not understand the concept of burden of proof?

Besides, I didn't ask if you thought that academic credentials are essential for the vs. debate, I asked you to provide them. Quit dodging.

I don't care much what SDN thinks collectively as a community.

Lame excuse.

After being fruitlessly attacked by numerous users, you mean?

The Black Knight always triumphs! Come back! I'll bite your legs off!

Seriously, I've never seen anyone face an argument by over four people at once over dozens of pages and not concede, or at least leave.

I recommend you go back and read carefully. Were there any users not part of the "SDN crowd" that were going through the thread and finding themselves convinced by either myself or the SDN crowd? If so, which did they find more convincing? Them, or me?

I have read carefully. The people participating in that thread basically amounted to:

1: You
2: The pro-Wars debaters, busy pummeling you over the dozens of pages.
3: Drooling idiots like HuskerJay and SSFPhoenix who respond with long debunked claims like 1.5 c and no lasers.
4: A group of inflammatory trolls.
5: The occasional person who contributed one post such as "I like trek better its more realistic", etc...

ST.com is both practically unmoderated and biased towards Trek by its very name. It's not a good place to say "See, these people agree with me, therefore I win!"

You really want to see if you're winning or losing, come over to SB.com and debate Trek vs. Wars there. I have come over and debated you at your site, and it would only be fair for you to do the same.

Or are you afraid of the big bad Alyeska (Who is no longer a mod)?

Once you have answered that question, you may start considering the question of who was "winning" or "losing" in any sense of the word.

As I've said, looking at a site that's biased towards Trek by its very nature is not a good way of telling who's objectively winning or losing a debate.

However, if you want to address any of this, I'm going to recommend a new topic.

I might do so for the technical discussions (Diesel fusion, travel time to Endor, etc...). Note that I didn't adress them in this debate, because I feel that it's not in the mood of the topic.

[Mr. Oragahn]

More dodging, more trying to do anything but give your credentials-especially since you've made the claim that your board seems more educated than him without giving any real proof. That claim is especially doubtful given that at least one of your members said that google was better than a formal education.

Opy, don't get confused. SDN has, as part of its plebe's habits, been slinging turd at many sites, the latest in date being SFJN. Slander and so on has rained, accusations of lack of education were found.
Your request is only a continuation of that sort game of late you likes enjoy - which is also used to divert attention from the topics which should be discussed.
Do use a favour and show some intelligence, for a change, by dropping this absurd crusade of yours.

+++

I think at this point, if they consider that you're a little uneducated kid just because you don't cater to their whims about disclosing your personnal bio, I'd say just leave them drool in their stupidity. That's calling a cat a cat.

Anyone intelligent out there can point at the pile of fallacies their stance relies on.
It is only tantamount to the asinine nature of SDN's motto.

Ah, besides, I see Poe has classicaly retreated to a fave tactic of his own: the theatrical strawman.
*sig*
These guys, really. That said, I'm not surprised Wayne misses the point. Neither am I on the fact that not a single soul at SDN can tell him to shut up for once, and stop embarassing his friends.
Or is it maybe because Poe's one of Wong's faves?

[l33telboi]

Opec, just out of curiosity, why did you think you should be the one posting this question? I mean, it's not like you have a degree in anything. Are you this desperate to gain the approval of the people you mee-toot for?

And a few more things i find comical:

Instead, you're squirming, and falling back on your love of "Civilized" discourse. Being polite and civilized doesn't make you any more honest, truthful, or even likeable.

Opec, would you care to remind me what happened during our last debate on SB? I recall you decided it was necessary to report me because I was apparently flaming you and not being civil enough. Of course the moderators and a few members apparently didn't agree with you on the flaming part, and told you so.

I mean really, you're the last person to complain about the 'be nice' rule, seeing as you are pretty much the most sensitive guy I’ve ever had the pleasure of debating.

Which I find humorous considering you're now trying to brown-nose on SDN, a place where behavior like that is despised.

Note that I didn't adress them in this debate, because I feel that it's not in the mood of the topic.

Oh come now, my dear Opec. We all know you didn't address them because you don't understand them or what the arguments are even about. Don't try to appear smarter then you are, it's way to easy to spot. Especially for people like me who've debated you on several occasions before.

As I've said, looking at a site that's biased towards Trek by its very nature is not a good way of telling who's objectively winning or losing a debate.

Tssk, tssk, tssk.

Again, what makes you think you're in any position to say these things? Remember what the first thing you ever said to me was? You joined up on IRC to basically say one thing to me "Stop wanking Starcraft, it's one of the weakest factions out there." And when asked why you think so, the answer was "Because I think it's silly."

Well, that's certainly not be best example of unbiased debating ever. But oddly enough - it gets better.

Over the next few months there are several SC threads popping up here and there and you join in on every one of them, always debating against SC and always you end up on the losing side. It all culminates in one final thread where you apparently have a meltdown of sorts, you start ranting and raving about how I'm flaming you, you decide to even report me to the moderators, however, they didn't think my behavior that bad. And apparently some members echoed that sentiment.

You finally left, saying this: "I've found that the reason why I've argued against Starcraft so much isn't the game itself so much as your attitude. Your attitude in my eyes has been arrogant, rude, and condesending, regardless of the topic being discussed. It's an unfortunate shame that my view of Starcraft has been clouded by your attitude."

That's a direct statement from you saying that you've participated in numerous debates and opted a stance against mine because of a personal vendetta.

I haven't seen you in any debate since then. You did join up on SDN to jump on the 'let's bash l33telboi' train though. Which I giggled at, seeing as you in this thread wanted JMS to join SB and stop 'hiding'.

So please, Opec. Kindly drop the "Biased" talk. You're the last person on this planet that has any right to go around claiming people are biased or unbiased. And most people can see through your mee-tooting and realize that you’re nothing but second rate debater trying to latch onto others because you don’t quite have it in you to form your own opinions and arguments.