Useful/useless educations

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Jedi Master Spock
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Useful/useless educations

Post by Jedi Master Spock » Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:26 pm

What, in your opinion, are the useful fields to be educated in, to what degree, and why, in the investigation of VS scenarios?

Think, if you will, of the hypothetical scenario that you are raising and educating a team of a half dozen or so, as if this were something gravely important, and it were vitally important to investigate the reality of each VS scenario and then present the results of each investigation.

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Post by Mike DiCenso » Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:27 am

Well, you can start with all the usual basic fields; astrophysics, engineering, mechanical engineering, high-energy physics. I might also add in planetary sciences and perhaps medical sciences, depending on the various scenarios presented.

Also one might consider making up the team from people who are not necessarily fans of either the Star Trek or Star Wars franchises in the hope of getting more unbiased results.
-Mike

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Re: Useful/useless educations

Post by 2046 » Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:32 am

Jedi Master Spock wrote:as if this were something gravely important
Aw c'mon . . . suspension of disbelief can only go so far. ;)

Overall, I'd say a well-rounded edumakashun is a start. There are certain things a really kick-ass debater needs to be able to do:

1. "Number-crunchy stuff":

Core mathematical strengths are very important. Ideally one would have the capacity to effortlessly do all the many calculations required, even to a level well beyond what is commonly seen among us. Me, I got well into calculus territory before going into the more liberal arts where none of that is considered required, so I often have to refresh myself before getting freaky with numbers.

2. Solid scientific foundation:

This goes without saying. From physics and mechanics to chemistry to space sciences, there's a ton of real-world detail that's relevant to the topic, and you need to have this background so you can know what to calculate.

3. Liberal arts:

This is a dirty concept to some, but it's more important than most realize. And I daresay that much of the underlying source of disagreement occurs as a result of this area being neglected by many.

Logic and philosophy, along with understanding the words and usages of English, are of paramount importance. The logic gives you a basis . . . the philosophy gives you the means to understand and apply the rules so that you can understand things according to them, recognize your own biases, and so on. After all, the researcher is also researched, and if one does not understand that something is what it is . . . that A is A . . . one can readily trick oneself into playing fast and loose with the data, no matter how good at the math and physics one might be. We treat this like it's objective reality . . . understanding objective reality is therefore incredibly important. Otherwise one's opinion is more or less random.

A well-rounded liberal arts education is very important. One needn't have the ability to run the Fed for this stuff, but a basic understanding of the forces of economics is handy. One needn't be able to out-do our greatest historians, but a knowledge of history and military history is important.

Indeed, understanding the human condition itself is a good thing, and that's one thing that almost can't be taught, since there are so many divergent opinions on the matter. But that brings us back to objective reality.

-------------

I feel like #3 above gets shortest shrift, despite being the longest. But one thing that this debater lacks is brevity . . . that might be of value to the team, too. ;)

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Post by watchdog » Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:05 am

Dont forget History, which you are doomed to repeat if you forget it.

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Post by Mike DiCenso » Fri Sep 21, 2007 11:43 pm

History is already covered in Robert's list of necessary fields. :-)
-Mike

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Post by GStone » Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:37 am

When you get to specific plans for tactics, some psychology is good.

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Post by watchdog » Sat Sep 22, 2007 4:28 am

Mike DiCenso wrote:History is already covered in Robert's list of necessary fields. :-)
-Mike
Oh my God! I can't read...AAAHHH!

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Post by GStone » Sat Sep 22, 2007 3:14 pm

Hooked On Phonics has helped millions of people. ;-)
GStone wrote:When you get to specific plans for tactics, some psychology is good.
Also, leadership training, organizational skills, efficiency training and applied knowledge for on the spot stuff.

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Post by Jedi Master Spock » Sat Sep 22, 2007 11:04 pm

While I don't think that history will actually help too much with analysis of the type typically seen in VS debates, philosophical training is quite useful.

A good grasp of epistemology and logic is crucially important for investigating an inconsistent system - as we see in both Star Trek and Star Wars.

I'm not sure some fields of science are as useful as others. Biology, for example; biology is highly useful for pointing out the cases in which Star Trek and Star Wars fail to measure up to real science, but not too useful in a conflict-based comparison.

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Post by Mike DiCenso » Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:56 pm

Although it might be covered above, I might also recommend having an economist or two on our hypothetical "Dream Team" here. Naturally the covering of the economies and industrial capacities of Trek and Wars are important for strategic as well as tactical reasons, and so having people who can examine in detail this important aspect I feel is a must.
-Mike

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