What's accepted SW canon?

[Nowhereman10]

Hey, I wasn't sure where to post this, so my apologies to the mods, if this isn't the right place. I've been doing battle with one Warsie after another on YouTube, each one just repeating the same load of propaganda off of Stardestroyer.net that they always have for years and years. Easy enough to take care of.

But the latest one is now claiming that George Lucas personally approved of the Incredible Cross Sections books in an interview, and that Leeland Chee is also supposed to claim the same thing for the ICS books for the Holocron. One of them placed in a snippet of a supposed interview, yet did not give the source of where it came from when asked.

Does anyone here know anything about this? I can't find anything that confrims this, except a bit on Wookiepedia that says that "reference books" are G-level canon, but it does not say which reference books, and there is nothing in the article references that I've found so far to back this up. Given how Wookiepedia changes practically every day with the whims and agendas of various factions, I'm a little skeptical. Thanks.

[KirkSkyWalker]

Hey, I wasn't sure where to post this, so my apologies to the mods, if this isn't the right place. I've been doing battle with one Warsie after another on YouTube, each one just repeating the same load of propaganda off of Stardestroyer.net that they always have for years and years. Easy enough to take care of.

But the latest one is now claiming that George Lucas personally approved of the Incredible Cross Sections books in an interview, and that Leeland Chee is also supposed to claim the same thing for the ICS books for the Holocron. One of them placed in a snippet of a supposed interview, yet did not give the source of where it came from when asked.

Does anyone here know anything about this? I can't find anything that confrims this, except a bit on Wookiepedia that says that "reference books" are G-level canon, but it does not say which reference books, and there is nothing in the article references that I've found so far to back this up. Given how Wookiepedia changes practically every day with the whims and agendas of various factions, I'm a little skeptical. Thanks.

Here's how it works: tell THEM to put up or shut up. The burden of proof is on THEM, not you. If they can't, then YOU WIN.
Easy peasy!

[Nowhereman10]

Yeah, but if you followed the link back to the video commentary we're debating this on, he won't shut the hell up about it.

[KirkSkyWalker]

Yeah, but if you followed the link back to the video commentary we're debating this on, he won't shut the hell up about it.

They're not debating, they're mastur-bating.

If they can't accept the basic facts of canon, then they're simply going to pick the most powerful figures in the EU, and claim it's just as valid as G-canon.

[Praeothmin]

Meanwhile, the Chee's words actually mean that the moral is the same between the two separate fictitious universes

And how did you come to this conclusion?
Chee says:

The quote you provide makes it sound like the EU is separate from George's vision of the Star Wars universe. It is not.

What are we talking about when we say "what is this guy's vision of the Democratic Party"?
We are talking about how this particular person sees life in general.
If you say "I have the same vision of the Democratic Party as you do", then you are not saying you believe in the same morals for two distinct but separate Democratic Parties.
You are actually talking about the same thing, and are saying you think the same as the other person in regards to the Democratic Party.

When Chee says that GL's vision of SW is not separate from the EU, then he means that the EU is part of SW, and exists in the same universe as GL's movie and TCW universe.
And as was demonstrated before, GL had as much involvement in TCW has he had in TESB, so while TCW is T-Canon, it is clearly part of GL's vision of SW, and part of GL's world...

And while I don't agree with many of Wong's comments and arguments, this one really has some merit:

When challenged by certain agenda-driven individuals who claimed that they studied George Lucas' public interviews and therefore knew his intentions better than people who worked with him professionally

Chee is closer to GL than any people claiming the EU is not true SW, so if he says it is, I'll believe him...

And this

However under no circumstances could anything but the movies-- and possibly the novelizations-- be valid for the film-universe.

I agree with, as the film-universe is called G-Canon, and while it exists in the same SW universe as the EU, it is at the top of the food chain.
But again, if something is never mentioned in the movies, yet is mentioned in the EU, then it does not automatically contradict the movies, since the movies never even mentioned it...

So for something to contradict the movie (or GL), it has to be something seen in the movies, yet presented in a contrary way in the EU.
For example, if the EU stated all Wookies were midgets, it would directly contradict all the OT, plus RotS, so that would be a contradiction.
If the EU mentions Luke's favorite color is blue, then is does not contradict anything, since the movies never mentioned it.
That is what "to contradict" means, not "it wasn't in the movies, so Luke has no favorite color"...

[KirkSkyWalker]

Chee says:
Quote:The quote you provide makes it sound like the EU is separate from George's vision of the Star Wars universe. It is not.

Pardon me while I laugh. In a 1994 interview with Lucas Licensing's Sue Rostoni and Allan Kausch in issue #23 of the Star Wars Insider, they said:

“ Gospel, or canon as we refer to it, includes the screenplays, the films, the radio dramas and the novelizations. These works spin out of George Lucas' original stories, the rest are written by other writers. However, between us, we've read everything, and much of it is taken into account in the overall continuity. The entire catalog of published works comprises a vast history — with many off-shoots, variations and tangents — like any other well-developed mythology.

Chee's just in charge of continuity-- you know that, right?
So to make-- or concur with-- Wong's arrogant, foaming-at-the-mouth statements like this:

"certain agenda-driven individuals who claimed that they studied George Lucas' public interviews and therefore knew his intentions better than people who worked with him professionally,"

he's really got to have a hella swelled head up his ass, in order to put his own words in Chee's mouth like that-- and then claim that it's Chee reading GL's mind!
ROTFLMAO

And those who support with his logic, can't be that far behind. :-D

Wong's only "merit" is that he beats "South Park" for a good laugh.

[Mike DiCenso]

Is English your second language?

Please don't go down this slippery slope. You were doing fairly well in coming back, don't ruin it by falling on bad habits when someone disagrees with you. Especially when you actually have a very good point there about Chee just monitoring continuity and maintaining it via the Holocron archive for the EU writers. Back it up with good evidence and don't cave in to anger.

So for this I'm giving you a semi-offical warning, nothing on file yet. Please pay heed.
-Mike

[KirkSkyWalker]

Is English your second language?

Please don't go down this slippery slope. You were doing fairly well in coming back, don't ruin it by falling on bad habits when someone disagrees with you.

You know what, you motherfucking piece of shit?
I dont' need this kind of humiliation, so go fuck yourself and your mother's asshole.
Capiche?

Jesus fucking christ, I give you a second chance and you blow it like you it was your daddy's cock.

Fuck off-- for GOOD this time. No more chances for your lame site that nobody visits, and you mods are drunk with power because you got no life.

[Mike DiCenso]

*Sigh* Have it your way. You want to be permabanned, you'll probably get it.
-Mike

[Trinoya]

Wait, he means our two mods? One of which was a recent addition? Drunk with power?

*blink blink* whoa.. all you did was suggest he tone it down a notch... I don't think I've seen the people at SB act that way towards anyone from this site.


In regards to the thread: I do recommend the cannonwars site that darkstar made as a collection of easy to find quotes and references. That may help you with your debate.

[Mike DiCenso]

Yeah, I did issue a warning for that last tirade of his there since that definitely crossed the line in more ways than one. Honestly, if KSW cannot control his anger, then it's for the best he not come back. What's sad is I even backed KSW up there by noting that he had a very good point about Chee.... That's not something a "power hungry" mod would necessarily do, if they were looking for an excuse to lay the smackdown on someone.

Just take look at Cpl Facehugger's past hits on SBC.
-Mike

[Nowhereman10]

In regards to the thread: I do recommend the cannonwars site that darkstar made as a collection of easy to find quotes and references. That may help you with your debate.

Thanks, but there's nothing specific on his site with regards to my question. Not unless I missed something, of course. I'm just putting out the question for anyone to see if they've heard of any of this BS before. Is there any truth at all to it?

[Praeothmin]

In a 1994 interview with Lucas Licensing's Sue Rostoni and Allan Kausch

Wow, the same Lucas Licensing which now has the canon policy we all know and love.
Guess someone from on high said:
"Hey, there's a lot of material out there, and we should probably find a way to separate GL originated material from the rest.
I got it, let's create a Cano-Policy, with orders of Canon that will be clear and help people understand the hierarchy in SW Canon."

Also:

These works spin out of George Lucas' original stories, the rest are written by other writers.

So by that account, TCW also is Canon, and should be part of the movie Canon, since GL works closely with the creators and writers of the show, even providing some stories and directions for it, in other words, as involved as he was with TESB...

And this:

However, between us, we've read everything, and much of it is taken into account in the overall continuity. The entire catalog of published works comprises a vast history — with many off-shoots, variations and tangents — like any other well-developed mythology.

Nowhere do they mention SW as a "duality", "dual universe", or two "distinct mythologies".
It's "mythology" in singular, not plural, so what was "Gospel", at a time where there was no Canon-policy, became G-Canon...

Chee's just in charge of continuity-- you know that, right?

And he's working for Lucas Licensing, the same entity you quoted from earlier.
And you really think he came up with the Canon-policy on his own, and no one above him had to approve?
And you really think GL, the guy that prohibited authors from killing Anakin because of the name, has no clue there is a Canon-policy about his universe?

Is English your second language?

Yes it is, I learned it when I was 2 1/2 years old, having learnt french much earlier.
Why, is it yours?
Because sometimes you don't seem to have a better grasp of it than I have.
For example, your complete misunderstanding of the meaning of "vision of" used in the sense Chee used it...

You know what, you motherfucking piece of shit?
I dont' need this kind of humiliation, so go fuck yourself and your mother's asshole.
Capiche?

Is that your evidence?
I fail to see the relevance with the topic at hand...

Jesus fucking christ, I give you a second chance and you blow it like you it was your daddy's cock.

Fuck off-- for GOOD this time. No more chances for your lame site that nobody visits, and you mods are drunk with power because you got no life.

Actually, we gave you the second chance because your first "parting post" was so over the top it should have merited you a ban, but we figured you had taken this time to cool off.
I guess we were wrong.

And we do have a life, adults thend to have them, having jobs, families, houses to take care of, while petulent kids blow up in people's faces when they are contradicted, and are asked to provide evidence for their bullshit but don't...
You'll eventually understand this when you're older, probably when you reach maturity (18), in, say, 6 years or so... ;)

[Khas]

Whoah, I missed the Return of KirkSkywalker? Praeothmin, why didn't you tell us about this on ASVS?

[Praeothmin]

It wasn'T really worth it, as you can see...