What's the canon policy of this site?

For all your discussion of canon policies, evidentiary standards, and other meta-debate issues.

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Nonamer
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What's the canon policy of this site?

Post by Nonamer » Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:20 pm

Merely wondering what it is. I don't think we'll get far in the debate if we don't have one. On Strek-v-Swars it was the movies and shows only. On SB.com it's whatever the canon policy of the license holders (albeit highly abused by Warsies so that canon policy is closer to SD.net regarding SW). Last of course is that of SDN, which states that ICS is ultimate canon above all else and next are the claims of Darth Wong with the rest of the actual movies, shows, and books of ST & SW holding the least validity in that order.

Personally I would like a canon policy between that of strek-v-swars and SB.com. Some respect should be given to the books and other non-visual material, but there must be a way to establish what is credible and what isn't. In particular the EU of SW, which is a mess and needs thorough canon regulation.
Last edited by Nonamer on Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jedi Master Spock
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Post by Jedi Master Spock » Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:00 pm

The policy of Starfleet Jedi is that we have no canon policy. In practical terms, for different sections of the website, this means different things.

For the purposes of the SFJN main website, we think our articles are fine regardless of which canon policy you subscribe to. That's discussed briefly here.

For the Open Database, with the purpose being as much as anything to encyclopedically present the difference in views among fans, we should "have" all the canon policies at once. Although the Open Database isn't very useful yet, it is getting to be a fairly good resource on the topic of canon in Star Trek and Star Wars.

For these forums, right now it's the responsibility of the original poster starting a debate thread in the "Trek/Wars" section to set down what the rules are for that thread. We will enforce those rules if necessary. If the members of this board in general agree on a particular canon policy that they can use for the purpose of debate - great! This forum section about the rules of evidence is here for the purpose of airing out and defining how the debate should proceed.

If it does become a problem, as you suggest, I will consider establishing an official canon policy to be enforced throughout these forums.

As a practical concern, when you say the EU is a mess and needs canon regulation, what techniques or standards do you think should be used to sort out what is credible and what isn't?

Nonamer
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Post by Nonamer » Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:27 pm

That might work, though it may lead to confusion down the road.

As for the EU, there are many highly contradictory works, as well as your general crap books. Notably offenders are the ICS, works from Karen Traviss, Darksaber (or all works from Kevin J. Anderson), etc. I'm sure others who have looked through them will find other highly problematic works.

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Post by Enterprise E » Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:22 pm

One possibility for this is to add a rule to the debate on this site that, at the CBR forums, is called the "Spider-Man vs. Firelord" )(or S-v-FL) rule. Basically, it stems from an incident where Spider-Man somehow defeated Firelord, a herald of Galactus and someone who Spider-Man should have had no chance of defeating. This rule has also been applied to feats that greatly exceeds, or is greatly inferior to, other established feats for any specified character, force, etc, that took place before and after said feat. It really has to be either a one time deal, or a feat that only comes into play when a certain writer is writing. For example, this is paraphrased from an explanation at the CBR forums, Batman sneaking up on Superman is not a S-v-FL feat since he has done it numerous times with different writers. However, if Batman were to knock Superman unconscious with a single punch if he had no Kryptonite on him, that would a violation of the S-v-FL exemption. A good possible example of a Spider-Man vs. Firelord feat in Star Wars is indeed the Star Wars E2 and E3 ICS's.

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Post by AnonymousRedShirtEnsign » Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:53 pm

Whether or not the EU is included, the average shoud be used. Meaning that Photon Torpedos have dozen to hundred MT range firepower, not low KT or mid GT. Similarly TLs can blow up small asteroids, not obliterate entire cities. I am opposed to the inclusion of the EU since George Lucas has mad it clear on multiple occations that the EU not part of his Star Wars. However if it is decide a some point to include the EU, then it should only be used as an extention of what is seen in the films. Outliers should also not be given much credence.

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Post by Trinoya » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:20 am

I believe it should be put to a vote then on which one the forum should use. One can still, of course, define their own personal debate, but having a default policy that can be quickly refrenced would at least allow some semblence of coherant debate begin.

Otherwise we can say to 200 gigaton firepower from a group of people who can't store 2 gigabites, lmao.

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Post by AnonymousRedShirtEnsign » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:53 am

I don't see any reason to put it to a vote or anything like that, yet. If it becomes an issue then yes, a board wide policy should come into existence, but until there is a problem with the question of what is canon there is no need to change the existing policy. Like the saying goes, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

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Post by Mike DiCenso » Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:22 pm

Honestly, I see a need for some kind of a coherent canon policy, otherwise anything and everything in ST and SW alike has equal validity. I think that's just bad, and as has been already pointed out, leads to extreme abuse and confusion down the road.
-Mike

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