ASVS is becoming a nuthouse

[Khas]

Oh God. They're claiming that the ICS has more authority than the NEG due to it having a physicist writing it. Maybe I should bring up that case of the one former Soviet Science Minister who claimed that Darwin was wrong about Evolution, and supported Lamarckian theories, because they agreed with Communist ideology.

[Khas]

Or, maybe I should just post the Metaverse Obliterator.

[Lucky]

Oh God. They're claiming that the ICS has more authority than the NEG due to it having a physicist writing it. Maybe I should bring up that case of the one former Soviet Science Minister who claimed that Darwin was wrong about Evolution, and supported Lamarckian theories, because they agreed with Communist ideology.

Appeal to Authority is a logical fallacy.
http://www.skepdic.com/authorty.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

Mr. Saxton at best suffers from garbage in garbage out problem as the Acclamator in the ICS prove. The information he had to work with was not what was used in the movie, and there is no way to judge yields for weapons that are never used, and no one can find. I would almost guess Saxton has only second hand information about much of Star Wars.

If Saxton was right then fighters would not be a threat, but we repeatedly see fighters take down capital ships with nothing but their blasters, and that ignores weapons like the proton cannons that could seemingly kill an acclamtor with one hit, but were far from gigatons in yields.
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb5 ... Ryloth.jpg

An interesting thing in Star wars is that the so called heavy guns are used for exactly the same things as the so called light guns, and the heavy guns are normally dialed down to mach the light guns. They are both used to attack capital ships and fighters.

Fighters are expected to destroy Capital ships as Anikin lost two Republic Attack Cruisers to vulture droids over Ryloth.

There are multiple battles in atmosphere with capital ships trying to kill each other, and nothing remotely ICS like happening like when Anikin had to save Jabba's son.

Star Wars: The Clone Wars is more then capable of showing the kind of battles the ICS describe, but never does. Note how the ICS do not make sense when these are super weapons, and note the character's reactions to them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltIgfpvNRE8

Physics as we know it does not apply to a lot of stuff in soft Sci-fi like Star Wars where there is literal magic.

[Khas]

Then why don't you come over to ASVS and help me out?

[Mr. Oragahn]

If Saxton was right then fighters would not be a threat, but we repeatedly see fighters take down capital ships with nothing but their blasters, and that ignores weapons like the proton cannons that could seemingly kill an acclamtor with one hit, but were far from gigatons in yields.
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb5 ... Ryloth.jpg

Regarding laser cannons (buffed blasters) vs capital ships, I dunno much about TCWS but in the movies this happens very little, if not never.
Shields down, windows and suchly exposed bridges are obvious weak spots.
But as long as shields are up, I fail to see fighters being ever relevant.
Eventually we had that small thread about fighters vs capital ships:
http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/view ... f=8&t=1975
I also spent a shit ton of time against SWST on the topic of turbolaser types and their use against a wide range of targets.

An interesting thing in Star wars is that the so called heavy guns are used for exactly the same things as the so called light guns, and the heavy guns are normally dialed down to mach the light guns. They are both used to attack capital ships and fighters.

Fighters are expected to destroy Capital ships as Anikin lost two Republic Attack Cruisers to vulture droids over Ryloth.

On a sidenote, the 1.5 megaton myth thread moved around page 10 onto the topic of gun nomenclature and their use against different types of targets.
A similar thread about spaceship guns nomenclature is found there:
http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/view ... 52&start=0

[sonofccn]

@ Khas:

Saw you were having some trouble with fighters vs capitol ships. If they want a prequal era example give them this:

PADME : We have a plan which should immobilize the Droid Army. We will send
what pilots we have to knock out the Droid control ship which is orbiting
the planet. If we can get past their rayshields, we can sever communication
and their droids will be helpless.
QUI-GON : A well-conceived plan. However, there's great risk. The weapons
on your fighters may not penetrate the shields on the control ship.

As taken from here

So , by an in-universe character, the attack was deemed "well-concieved" and there was only a chance the weapons might not penetrate the shields so clearly QUI-GON as well as Padme who didn't correct him intended to take the droidship out the brute force way rather than pray for a random miracle. Any argument to the countrary would require a specific piece of evidence, say a pilot directly admitting they have no chance, to be worthy of debating.

Further, should they claim that just means proton torpedoes are more powerful, please remind them that the larger, less agile missiles on Slave 1 are only rated at a 190 megatons by the ICS which wouldn't scratch the paint of a 3 KM battleship under that same source.

Incidently on a more personal note I noted from Scvn2812 an almost purist attitude, albiet presupposed to ICS yields, deriding much of the EU. A curious, and selective, belief system I'd previously encountered in another radical Warsie and I was curious, since I have more limited contact with the "enemy", if this was an actual trend among their number or mere random happenstance.

EDIT: Also looking again I think your being way to generous in letting Scvn assume Vader intended to bombard Hoth from range. From here:

VADER
What is it, General?

VEERS
My lord, the fleet has moves out
of light-speed. Com-Scan has
detected an energy field protecting
an area around the sixth planet of
the Hoth system. The field is
strong enough to deflect any
bombardment.

VADER
(angrily)
The Rebels are alerted to our
presence. Admiral Ozzel came out
of light-speed too close to the
system.

VEERS
He felt surprise was wiser...

VADER
He is as clumsy as he is stupid.
General, prepare your troops for a
surface attack.

VEERS
Yes, my lord.

Vader and Veers appear to be talking about stealth not bombardment. That the Rebels know they are there. Indeed Ozzel, prefering surprise over the alternative, could be argued to be the bombardment minded one. His "plan", such as it was, appearing to be to drop smack dab on top of the Rebel scum and neutrilize them in a single stroke which if they hadn't had a theater shield and ion cannon might even have worked.

Further we have this tidbit from ROTJ:

103 INT SUPER STAR DESTROYER - BRIDGE

Admiral Piett and two fleet commanders watch the battle at the huge
window of the Super Star Destroyer bridge.

COMMANDER
We're in attack position now, sir.

PIETT
Hold here.

COMMANDER
We're not going to attack?

As the script notes we can see the Rebel fleet from the bridge and yet a "hold here" command clearly indiciates they are not to attack rather than engage from their position. Strongly hinting at the effective range of an Imperial Star Destroyer.

[mojo]

VEERS
My lord, the fleet has moves out
of light-speed.

should i assume that jasonb replaced the original actor who played 'veers' in the new blu-ray edition?

[Lucky]

Then why don't you come over to ASVS and help me out?

I have two reasons honestly?

2) I was thinking of joining, but then all you guys seemed to do was flame Jason do to grammar issues, and that just isn't my style.

1) I honestly can't stand the way you guys decorated the site. The starscape wallpaper behind the white posts that are sitting on a transparent shadow is unpleasant to look at, and makes things harder to read. If it was easy to read like Spacebattles, Stardestroyer.net, Starfleet jedi, youtube, or fukufics.com I would be far more likely to join.
______
You may want to look into the SW:TCW episode "Landing at Point Rain". The Republic sends ground troops to destroy a somehow active battle droid and tank factory on the already defeated Geonosis instead of trying to just blasting the factory from orbit, or sending in bombers. Why the bleep would plan A be to send ground troops to set bombs inside the factory?

The Factory had a shield, but the shield wasn't turned on until the ground troops were basically at the factory's front door in the literal sense.

Just think of the number of ICS claims that are called into question.

[Tyralak]

1) I honestly can't stand the way you guys decorated the site. The starscape wallpaper behind the white posts that are sitting on a transparent shadow is unpleasant to look at, and makes things harder to read. If it was easy to read like Spacebattles, Stardestroyer.net, Starfleet jedi, youtube, or fukufics.com I would be far more likely to join.

I can add additional styles, you know. Show me something you like, and I'll set it up.

[Khas]

Then why don't you come over to ASVS and help me out?

I have two reasons honestly?

2) I was thinking of joining, but then all you guys seemed to do was flame Jason do to grammar issues, and that just isn't my style.

1) I honestly can't stand the way you guys decorated the site. The starscape wallpaper behind the white posts that are sitting on a transparent shadow is unpleasant to look at, and makes things harder to read. If it was easy to read like Spacebattles, Stardestroyer.net, Starfleet jedi, youtube, or fukufics.com I would be far more likely to join.
______
You may want to look into the SW:TCW episode "Landing at Point Rain". The Republic sends ground troops to destroy a somehow active battle droid and tank factory on the already defeated Geonosis instead of trying to just blasting the factory from orbit, or sending in bombers. Why the bleep would plan A be to send ground troops to set bombs inside the factory?

The Factory had a shield, but the shield wasn't turned on until the ground troops were basically at the factory's front door in the literal sense.

Just think of the number of ICS claims that are called into question.

Well, Jason hasn't shown up there in quite some time. And it was more his outlandish claims (Enterprise-D chewing up the Death Star with phasers, Federation winning the war in "Yesterday's Enterprise", stuff like that) then grammar. Eventually, we eased up on him (mostly), and only gave him occasional ribbings. Then, one day, he just stopped showing up.

[Lucky]

Well, Jason hasn't shown up there in quite some time. And it was more his outlandish claims (Enterprise-D chewing up the Death Star with phasers, Federation winning the war in "Yesterday's Enterprise", stuff like that) then grammar. Eventually, we eased up on him (mostly), and only gave him occasional ribbings. Then, one day, he just stopped showing up.

I just think things work best when you try to do things in a polite manner.

The Enterprise-D did drill about half way through a M-class planet in a little less then half a minute on screen. Claiming the E-D could turn the Death Star into Swiss cheese isn't really all that outlandish. The only defenses the Death Star 1 had was armor, Turbolasers, and fighters/bombers, and the only real defense against starship phasers is shields really. You might disagree, but it is hardly a crazy conclusion to come to.

He start an Yesterday's Enterprise thread here.

[Mr. Oragahn]

Then why don't you come over to ASVS and help me out?

I have two reasons honestly?

2) I was thinking of joining, but then all you guys seemed to do was flame Jason do to grammar issues, and that just isn't my style.

1) I honestly can't stand the way you guys decorated the site. The starscape wallpaper behind the white posts that are sitting on a transparent shadow is unpleasant to look at, and makes things harder to read. If it was easy to read like Spacebattles, Stardestroyer.net, Starfleet jedi, youtube, or fukufics.com I would be far more likely to join.
______
You may want to look into the SW:TCW episode "Landing at Point Rain". The Republic sends ground troops to destroy a somehow active battle droid and tank factory on the already defeated Geonosis instead of trying to just blasting the factory from orbit, or sending in bombers. Why the bleep would plan A be to send ground troops to set bombs inside the factory?

The Factory had a shield, but the shield wasn't turned on until the ground troops were basically at the factory's front door in the literal sense.

Just think of the number of ICS claims that are called into question.

Well, Jason hasn't shown up there in quite some time. And it was more his outlandish claims (Enterprise-D chewing up the Death Star with phasers, Federation winning the war in "Yesterday's Enterprise", stuff like that) then grammar. Eventually, we eased up on him (mostly), and only gave him occasional ribbings. Then, one day, he just stopped showing up.

And then how active was the board when he stopped posting?

[Lucky]

1) I honestly can't stand the way you guys decorated the site. The starscape wallpaper behind the white posts that are sitting on a transparent shadow is unpleasant to look at, and makes things harder to read. If it was easy to read like Spacebattles, Stardestroyer.net, Starfleet jedi, youtube, or fukufics.com I would be far more likely to join.

I can add additional styles, you know. Show me something you like, and I'll set it up.

I named four forums and youtube in the post you quoted.

You might want to compare the differences between ASVS and them. The problem is the text blending in with the starscape you have there. Having the text on a solid area instead of the transparent thing you have the text on would go a long way to improving your site's usability. I'm talking about all of the text on the site.

You might have noticed that wikis that have a wallpaper like your site does have the text on a solid area that blocks the view of the wallpaper. Here is an example: http://clonewars.wikia.com/wiki/The_Clone_Wars_Wiki. You will note how the wallpaper in the background is in the background unlike your site.

[Tyralak]

I named four forums and youtube in the post you quoted.

You might want to compare the differences between ASVS and them. The problem is the text blending in with the starscape you have there. Having the text on a solid area instead of the transparent thing you have the text on would go a long way to improving your site's usability. I'm talking about all of the text on the site.

You might have noticed that wikis that have a wallpaper like your site does have the text on a solid area that blocks the view of the wallpaper. Here is an example: http://clonewars.wikia.com/wiki/The_Clone_Wars_Wiki. You will note how the wallpaper in the background is in the background unlike your site.

Done. Tell me what you think.

[Mr. Oragahn]

You might have noticed that wikis that have a wallpaper like your site does have the text on a solid area that blocks the view of the wallpaper. Here is an example: http://clonewars.wikia.com/wiki/The_Clone_Wars_Wiki. You will note how the wallpaper in the background is in the background unlike your site.

Does it need to be said that the CW wiki looks crap?
Have you looked at the watermarked Halo wikis ?