SBC thread on SW firepower... again... :)

[Mr. Oragahn]

I'm sorry, but something like this really sounds simply too ridiculous to be coming from an adult. I mean, this sounds like some of the shit I thought of in 4th grade where we all thought teachers were all just secretly out to stop us from having fun.

You're totally correct. I'm 3 years old, which means I'm way smarter than you ever were at that age.
Other than that, perhaps you may want to cut the trolling, eh?

Man, sometimes I wish there was a secret SW40Ker mod cabal. Just might have saved me the small mountain of infractions and occasional bans I earned for incredibly inane shit while debating against Star Trek in various vs. threads.

Speaking of a cabal/conspiracy/illunacy is just a way to blow things out of proportions in the vain hope of discrediting my complaints, which are perfectly legit.
The fact that the same punks always got a free ride is just a fact.
Like I said, let's debate the points and we'll see. Shouting wolf but doing nothing won't get you any points.

In any case, how does your little theory account for somebody like higbvuyb?

What about him?
Was he longly debating against the ICS and SW wanking when mods were clearly banning people for doing so? I don't know, but I was.
Was he longly debating against the 40K wanking when mods were clearly banning people for doing so? I don't know, but I was.
The only reason the wanking softened is that, aside from new mods coming in, people like me (and others) actually took most of the flak for it.
For both reasons, I exposed myself to the very biased moderations of those respective times. All of which happened well before you even joined, 7th of May in 2011.
I know what I'm talking about. You clearly don't.

Who's talking about flaming?

You are? Like, now I guess?

Yes, now, since you brought the point. But you mentionned flaming, yet I don't see where you got that from before your post.
I could be wrong but I don't think the talks dealt with flaming.
In a way or another, please clarify.

Oh, just on a that note. Since when have you been reading Leo's posts? I've been on SBC long before you even registered at SBC, and I know the amount of baiting and flaming he'd use to get what he wanted. He always got out of it unharmed.

Then apparently things must have suddenly changed in the last year and a half. I don't really know how you're defining 'flaming' in this context(I'm pretty sure including mean words along with your argument is not flaming).

It actually is, you know.
FYI, Leo1 has softened his positions, and isn't debating SW bits and nails like he used to. This might explain a few things. All for the better, mind you.
The other fact is that SW wanking is nearly dead these days, despite some periodical bumps. The ICS poll that was posted at SBC a couple years ago just cemented that fact once and for all.
Again, you don't remember, but the ICS debates were so hot that a mod, Skyzeta I think, even wanted to ban them and force the ICS into all SW related threads. People were getting banned (not just me) for leveling arguments (and no flaming) against SW wanking.
These days, laughing at SW wanking is pure routine. It is almost seen as bad as Halo wanking about UNSC/Covenant conventional firepower.

Yeah, when he backpedaled from his mundane megajoule pistol shots.
What makes you think Connor is so important that I have to register to his RSS feed so I don't miss his latest twist in dialectics?
More to the point; why do you defend him so badly? Did he save your cat from drowning or something?

Nah, I'm just a semantic jackass and noticed you still seemed to think he was arguing teratons and whatnot for 40k. I don't exactly agree with his new position, and I don't particularly care too much about your little back and forth exchanges over the years either. ;)

Well then why rub it in if you don't care (not to say that there hasn't been a single exchange between me and broken clock that I could remember)?

[Lucky]

I think the word conspiracy is a bit strong. Getting rid of Mr.O killed the most interesting threads to read at Spacebattles.

Thanks but you're out selling the trinket here. There's plenty of good stuff to read at SBC, even if you only intend to produce a fiction that shall make sense. The technical forum is that odd crossover between a fanboy's dreams and the American Scientist.

I still read new debates at SB.com, but there are far fewer people worth reading when it comes to the debates that interest me. You put a lot of effort into your debates that seems to only be matched by someone like Jared. Look at post 931 to see what I mean.
http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/ ... 34/page-38
I respect debaters who back up their arguments with evidence.
_____
Would you mind explaining the "fanboy's dreams and the American Scientist" remark? I'm not clear on what that means.

[Lucky]

I'm sorry, but something like this really sounds simply too ridiculous to be coming from an adult. I mean, this sounds like some of the shit I thought of in 4th grade where we all thought teachers were all just secretly out to stop us from having fun.

You're totally correct. I'm 3 years old, which means I'm way smarter than you ever were at that age.
Other than that, perhaps you may want to cut the trolling, eh?

Man, sometimes I wish there was a secret SW40Ker mod cabal. Just might have saved me the small mountain of infractions and occasional bans I earned for incredibly inane shit while debating against Star Trek in various vs. threads.

Speaking of a cabal/conspiracy/illunacy is just a way to blow things out of proportions in the vain hope of discrediting my complaints, which are perfectly legit.
The fact that the same punks always got a free ride is just a fact.
Like I said, let's debate the points and we'll see. Shouting wolf but doing nothing won't get you any points.

In any case, how does your little theory account for somebody like higbvuyb?

What about him?
Was he longly debating against the ICS and SW wanking when mods were clearly banning people for doing so? I don't know, but I was.
Was he longly debating against the 40K wanking when mods were clearly banning people for doing so? I don't know, but I was.
The only reason the wanking softened is that, aside from new mods coming in, people like me (and others) actually took most of the flak for it.
For both reasons, I exposed myself to the very biased moderations of those respective times. All of which happened well before you even joined, 7th of May in 2011.
I know what I'm talking about. You clearly don't.

Who's talking about flaming?

You are? Like, now I guess?

Yes, now, since you brought the point. But you mentionned flaming, yet I don't see where you got that from before your post.
I could be wrong but I don't think the talks dealt with flaming.
In a way or another, please clarify.

Oh, just on a that note. Since when have you been reading Leo's posts? I've been on SBC long before you even registered at SBC, and I know the amount of baiting and flaming he'd use to get what he wanted. He always got out of it unharmed.

Then apparently things must have suddenly changed in the last year and a half. I don't really know how you're defining 'flaming' in this context(I'm pretty sure including mean words along with your argument is not flaming).

It actually is, you know.
FYI, Leo1 has softened his positions, and isn't debating SW bits and nails like he used to. This might explain a few things. All for the better, mind you.
The other fact is that SW wanking is nearly dead these days, despite some periodical bumps. The ICS poll that was posted at SBC a couple years ago just cemented that fact once and for all.
Again, you don't remember, but the ICS debates were so hot that a mod, Skyzeta I think, even wanted to ban them and force the ICS into all SW related threads. People were getting banned (not just me) for leveling arguments (and no flaming) against SW wanking.
These days, laughing at SW wanking is pure routine. It is almost seen as bad as Halo wanking about UNSC/Covenant conventional firepower.

Yeah, when he backpedaled from his mundane megajoule pistol shots.
What makes you think Connor is so important that I have to register to his RSS feed so I don't miss his latest twist in dialectics?
More to the point; why do you defend him so badly? Did he save your cat from drowning or something?

Nah, I'm just a semantic jackass and noticed you still seemed to think he was arguing teratons and whatnot for 40k. I don't exactly agree with his new position, and I don't particularly care too much about your little back and forth exchanges over the years either. ;)

Well then why rub it in if you don't care (not to say that there hasn't been a single exchange between me and broken clock that I could remember)?

I'm not so sure there has been a major change. I can't figure out why Atom and Leo1 are getting off without the same warnings as Mith and Jared?

http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/ ... 34/page-40
So yeah. Imagine my irritation at being called in to examine this thread for shenanigans after I've mostly stopped caring about SW vs Trek. Then imagine my irritation at finding a whole lot of shenanigans. Frankly, I'm thinking I'll just give this thread the Emperor's Mercy and be done with it because it's pretty much run its course and devolved into shitflinging.

Atom and l33telboi are the only ones actually discussing something relevant to the thread at this point. It's been awhile since I've followed the whole ST/SW debate, but apparently you guys are still hyperfocused on canon, even though people have actually gotten direct quotes straight from the LFL canon archivist. What the fuck guys. Find something better to argue about. Talk about how, I dunno, AT-TE ball guns clearly aren't five gigajoules or whatever ICS says they are. Or how one Accalmator's point defense gun could vaporize the droid army on Geonosis with casual ease. Or something. But stop shitting up these boards with canon discussions when the other side has actual representatives of LFL saying you're wrong. Stop trying to cherrypick a handful of off-the-cuff quotes to magazines from six years ago in order to override stated official canon policy, because that sort of bullshit wouldn't fly with any other franchise.

In short, Mith and Jared, cut it the hell out. Disagree with the figures in the ICS all you like, show they're invalid by citing other sources and crushing all proposed counterexplanations all you like, but stop wasting server space talking about how how your interpretation of canon is better than the guy who's whole job is to arbitrate canon because you're interpreting some remarks from George Lucas in a couple of random interviews six years ago in one particular fashion. It's doing yourselves a great disservice.

Jared is sticking to the topic, but Leo1 isn't. Leo1 also seems to not be responding to Jared's arguments.

Mith is as off topic as Atom, but Mith has poked holes in Atom's argument.

Why hasn't Sci-Fi Fan been banned for trolling? His argument has been counted by at least 2 people in the same thread. Hell I beat him in a debate here when he used the same arguments.

[Praeothmin]

Because Warsies have Mod friends? :)

[Lucky]

Because Warsies have Mod friends? :)

That seems like a good reason to use Sci-Fi Fan as a sacrificial Lamb?

[Praeothmin]

Now, atom, if Leo1 isn't protected by the Mods over there, then, praytell, why is he th eonly one who, while ignoring all of Jared's links to low Firepower displays, and also participating in Mith's and Jared's Canon debate, does he not even get a mention in Facehugger's post, the one where he calls out some apparently bad behavior on the part of some debaters (well, actually, just Jared and Mith)...

In short, Mith and Jared, cut it the hell out. Disagree with the figures in the ICS all you like, show they're invalid by citing other sources and crushing all proposed counterexplanations all you like, but stop wasting server space talking about how how your interpretation of canon is better than the guy who's whole job is to arbitrate canon because you're interpreting some remarks from George Lucas in a couple of random interviews six years ago in one particular fashion. It's doing yourselves a great disservice.

Apparently, Leo1 didn't participate, or fuel the debate, and apparently, Facehugger also ignored all of Jared's evidence that G and T Canon battles shit all over the ICS's Firepower figures...

It's a good thing Leo1 isn't protected by the Mods then... :)

EDIT: I also notice a lack of warning for SciFiFan, our very own SWST...
Hhhhmm, isn't he also a Warsie?

Naaaahhhh, that can't be...

[mojo]

i CANNOT BELIEVE that swst is STILL trying to make the BALL-BUSTINGLY STUPID argument that acceleration/speed of wars ships can be calculated using the 'dooku's ship moves from the ground to the outer rings of the planet in the time it takes yoda to pick up his cane' thing, regardless of all common sense and evidence that the idea is retarded.
HEY JACKASS, IT'S A FUCKING JUMP CUT, THERE'S NO REASON TO ASSUME DOOKU'S SHIP MOVES IN REALTIME RELATIVE TO WHAT WE SEE! DID YOU EVER STOP TO THINK THAT MAYBE OTHER THINGS HAPPEN THAT WOULD BE BORING TO WATCH?

dooku's ship takes off
cut to yoda picking up his cane
(unseen, yoda inspects the damage to obi-wan and anakin, then calls for help. he occupies himself while he waits by using the force to manipulate their unconscious bodies into *ahem* naughty positions and making them pick each other's noses)
cut back to dooku's ship, now passing the outer rings of the planet

that actually wouldn't be boring, but YOU SEE WHAT I MEAN.

my favorite part:

some guy: you realize that if a ship accelerated at that speed, the friction between the ship and THE AIR would cause a massive explosion!
swst: SHUT THE FUCK UP IT HAPPENED ACCEPT IT
some guy: this is high school science, man, and--
swst: FUCK SCIENCE IT DOESN'T MATTER IT HAPPENED ACCEPT IT(paraphrased)

isn't this the guy that invested a pretty decent amount of time trying to convince this board that the TREK SIDE refuses to acknowledge or address logical arguments when they don't fit the party line?

[Praeothmin]

He's also the same guys who uses math to calculate the power it takes for this kind of acceleration, but then ignores science when it tells him that Dooku's ship would have killed everyone in an area of a couple of km... :)

Good old SWST...

[Mr. Oragahn]

i CANNOT BELIEVE that swst is STILL trying to make the BALL-BUSTINGLY STUPID argument that acceleration/speed of wars ships can be calculated using the 'dooku's ship moves from the ground to the outer rings of the planet in the time it takes yoda to pick up his cane' thing, regardless of all common sense and evidence that the idea is retarded.
HEY JACKASS, IT'S A FUCKING JUMP CUT, THERE'S NO REASON TO ASSUME DOOKU'S SHIP MOVES IN REALTIME RELATIVE TO WHAT WE SEE! DID YOU EVER STOP TO THINK THAT MAYBE OTHER THINGS HAPPEN THAT WOULD BE BORING TO WATCH?

dooku's ship takes off
cut to yoda picking up his cane
(unseen, yoda inspects the damage to obi-wan and anakin, then calls for help. he occupies himself while he waits by using the force to manipulate their unconscious bodies into *ahem* naughty positions and making them pick each other's noses)
cut back to dooku's ship, now passing the outer rings of the planet

that actually wouldn't be boring, but YOU SEE WHAT I MEAN.

my favorite part:

some guy: you realize that if a ship accelerated at that speed, the friction between the ship and THE AIR would cause a massive explosion!
swst: SHUT THE FUCK UP IT HAPPENED ACCEPT IT
some guy: this is high school science, man, and--
swst: FUCK SCIENCE IT DOESN'T MATTER IT HAPPENED ACCEPT IT(paraphrased)

isn't this the guy that invested a pretty decent amount of time trying to convince this board that the TREK SIDE refuses to acknowledge or address logical arguments when they don't fit the party line?

In essence, exactly the claim Brian Young made.
http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/view ... 980#p41980

[Mike DiCenso]

Then using his logic, in ST:FC, the jump cut between Captain Picard ordering the E-E to maximum warp from the Neutral Zone and the arrival 30 seconds later to fight the Borg cube at Earth is a legitimate way to calculate way warp speeds in Trek. Thanks to ST:ENT's "Dead Stop", we know that Romulan space is at least 150 light years from Earth, so that means the E-E was doing around 157,680,000 c!

See how easy that is?
-Mike

[Praeothmin]

That makes two threads that have been closed by Mods in which SWST still claims his bullshit about Dooku's ship while ignoring the absence of atmospheric effects, and now unsurprisingly, Leo1 agrees with SWST's bullshit argument, without providing any intelligent explanation as to why we don't see evidence of the huge power being dumped...
When someone says "Technobabble" to explain it, he says it stilldoesn't mean the ship doesn't generate the calculated power because... Well, just because... :)

[Mr. Oragahn]

That makes two threads that have been closed by Mods in which SWST still claims his bullshit about Dooku's ship while ignoring the absence of atmospheric effects, and now unsurprisingly, Leo1 agrees with SWST's bullshit argument, without providing any intelligent explanation as to why we don't see evidence of the huge power being dumped...
When someone says "Technobabble" to explain it, he says it stilldoesn't mean the ship doesn't generate the calculated power because... Well, just because... :)

Either Leo1 is an idiot, or he argues for the sake of it, his motivation being sheer lawyer pride, a man capable of winning any argument because he's simply that good at it. Like Wong said, truth doesn't matter. What does is winning.

SWST is a troll so it doesn't matter, but Leo1, it's hard to believe he's just that impaired, so I think he just does it for the kicks, with a fine touch of trolling more or less under the very kind protection of his local angels.

[Praeothmin]

Yeah, but he's not that good at it...
He only "wins" because the Mods let him do/ignore whatever he wishes...
His arguments are basic repeats, for the most part, of SWST's arguments, so just as idiotic...

[Lucky]

Either Leo1 is an idiot, or he argues for the sake of it, his motivation being sheer lawyer pride, a man capable of winning any argument because he's simply that good at it. Like Wong said, truth doesn't matter. What does is winning.

Claiming the truth does not matter is an oddly unscientific point of view for someone who claims to pride himself on being logical and scientific.

Leo1 can only do what he does because the mods let him break the rules.

SWST is a troll so it doesn't matter, but Leo1, it's hard to believe he's just that impaired, so I think he just does it for the kicks, with a fine touch of trolling more or less under the very kind protection of his local angels.

Leo1 needs the mods to bail him out, and ignore his behavior. In other word, he lacks to skill to win even if wrong.