Darkstar's warp ramming page - an idea

[Praeothmin]

If you want to say that Voyager was not surrounded by a warp-field then you must show the warpcore was offline.

Are you talking about when it was crashing, or when it was approaching the planet?
Because, going from my understanding of what Warp Fields do, if the Warpo Core had been online at the moment of the crash, there would have been some mighty damage done to the surface of the planet by that "space distorting" field, which there wasn't...

Where exactly do you get "Warp Core on = Warp Field on" anyways?
Because my car's engine can be on, and I'm not going forward because I didn't shift in "drive" (creating a Warp Field for propulsion), and pressed the pedal to the metal (increasing power to Warp Field for faster Warp Speeds)...

[Lucky]

If you want to say that Voyager was not surrounded by a warp-field then you must show the warpcore was offline.

Are you talking about when it was crashing, or when it was approaching the planet?
Because, going from my understanding of what Warp Fields do, if the Warpo Core had been online at the moment of the crash, there would have been some mighty damage done to the surface of the planet by that "space distorting" field, which there wasn't...

Voyager could have caused the tiny amount of damage it did for any number of reasons like the navigational deflector somehow dissipating the energy.

We have examples of little damage, but high impact speeds like when the Delta Flyer crashed, and bared it's self 3 kilometers underground, in "Skin of Evil" we have a nice neat shuttle sized hole in a mountain side yet no sign of much damage to the surrounding area, a torpedo makes a clean circular hole in the side of the Defiant, we have the Dominion ship that crashed and embedded it's self in a cliff face...

Where exactly do you get "Warp Core on = Warp Field on" anyways?
Because my car's engine can be on, and I'm not going forward because I didn't shift in "drive" (creating a Warp Field for propulsion), and pressed the pedal to the metal (increasing power to Warp Field for faster Warp Speeds)...

If the warp-coils are getting power then they should be creating a warp-field.

When have we seen a diagram of a Star Trek with the warp-field off?

[Mike DiCenso]

When have we seen a diagram of a Star Trek with the warp-field off?

That's kind of a bit of a canard since when we are shown a warp field diagram, the ship is at warp or preparing to go to warp, or doing something unsual, like was the case in "Deja Q" to reduce the moon's mass.
-Mike

[Lucky]

When have we seen a diagram of a Star Trek with the warp-field off?

That's kind of a bit of a canard since when we are shown a warp field diagram, the ship is at warp or preparing to go to warp, or doing something unsual, like was the case in "Deja Q" to reduce the moon's mass.
-Mike

How is that an unfounded rumor or story?

We know warp fields at least can be generated when ships aren't moving from "Remember Me".

[2046]

The view is not unobstructed. You are seeing the event through a warp field.

{...}

If you want to say that Voyager was not surrounded by a warp-field then you must show the warpcore was offline.

It is quite dangerous to play such a potentially wide-ranging "visual distortion" card. Evildoers could simply claim that all of Trek is seen through subspace fields and thence make up whatever they want.

This is not to say that such a card is always invalid, but that sort of thing is to be used only as a last resort to avoid massive contradiction, and preferably in supported situations (e.g. related comments of extreme sensor distortion and so on).

I don't think this event qualifies at all.

[Mike DiCenso]

We know warp fields at least can be generated when ships aren't moving from "Remember Me".

That still isn't proof that ships constantly generate warp fields 24/7 when not travelling FTL.
-Mike

[Picard]

I think Darkstar already pointed out issue when any possible subspace anomaly nullifies both warp and impulse. Meaning that impulse is more like STL-optimized warp drive. However, that would mean that there is no time dilation involved in either impulse or warp flight, and that impulse engines could propel ship at FTL. It might also be that impulse is just standard rocket drive, and uses mass lightening fields to achieve better performance.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Impulse_drive

Memory Alpha seems to support combination of options - there is no warp field, but there is subspace field and rocket-type thrust is used (except that propellant is high-velocity plasma accelerated by magnetic coils). In 2270's impulse drive was capable of sustaining 0.5 c without warp drive being online - which is quite wierd choice of words, since you don't need any power to sustain already achieved velocity in vacuum. You only need modest power to counter gravitational influences.

As for "Fair Haven", it is already solved issue - impulse drive on its own isn't enough to outrun 2/3c storm, but needs "hand" from warp drive. Or it was about fusion reactors...

[Lucky]

We know warp fields at least can be generated when ships aren't moving from "Remember Me".

That still isn't proof that ships constantly generate warp fields 24/7 when not travelling FTL.
-Mike

There's no need to twist my argument to absurd lengths. I never claimed ships are always generated warp fields. I merely claim that ships generate warp fields when their warp drive receives power.

The way Federation ships seem to be set up is that so long as the warp core is generating power there is power going to the warp drive, and navigational deflector. I may be misremembering things so feel free to correct me.

[Lucky]

The view is not unobstructed. You are seeing the event through a warp field.

{...}

If you want to say that Voyager was not surrounded by a warp-field then you must show the warpcore was offline.

It is quite dangerous to play such a potentially wide-ranging "visual distortion" card. Evildoers could simply claim that all of Trek is seen through subspace fields and thence make up whatever they want.

This is not to say that such a card is always invalid, but that sort of thing is to be used only as a last resort to avoid massive contradiction, and preferably in supported situations (e.g. related comments of extreme sensor distortion and so on).

I don't think this event qualifies at all.

Perhaps you could be a lot less cryptic?

The fact of the matter is the Phoenix in First Contact was moving much faster then it appeared to be. If ships appear to be moving more slowly then they really are then they must not be where they appear to be either.

[Picard]

We know warp fields at least can be generated when ships aren't moving from "Remember Me".

That still isn't proof that ships constantly generate warp fields 24/7 when not travelling FTL.
-Mike

There's no need to twist my argument to absurd lengths. I never claimed ships are always generated warp fields. I merely claim that ships generate warp fields when their warp drive receives power.

The way Federation ships seem to be set up is that so long as the warp core is generating power there is power going to the warp drive, and navigational deflector. I may be misremembering things so feel free to correct me.

Warp nacelles and NavDeflector always glow, wether ship is at warp or impulse. Only occasions I can recall of nacelles and deflector not glowing were when ship had no power at all. So I'd say you're correct.

[Praeothmin]

As I said, the Warp Drive can be online while not creating any Warp Fields...
Like a car engine that is turned on, but is on Neutral...

[Lucky]

As I said, the Warp Drive can be online while not creating any Warp Fields...
Like a car engine that is turned on, but is on Neutral...

That's not a good analogy since all a warp drive does is create and manipulate warp fields.

Airplanes can have their engines running, and not move, but a engine is still moving air.

[Picard]

True. And as for car analogy - even when car doesn't move, it is still using fuel, and moving parts of engine - only transmission to the wheels has been cut off. Starships are different in that regard, energy must be used for something, and in starship not producing warp field, warp nacelles would not glow at all. Yet they do, at both warp and impulse; but far more intensely at warp.

[Praeothmin]

The way I understand Warp, is that as soon as you create a Warp Field, you are moving at Warp, but more importantly, you are moving...
If Warp fields are active when the ship is not at Warp, then why the heck do ships have Impulse engines?
Why do they use them?

[Picard]

Impulse engines are implied to be something akin to thrusters, yet we see no exhaust even at high impulse. So it might be that nacelles generate some sort of mass lightening field, helping impulse engines to do the work, but warp drive isn't power efficient enough to propel ship at STL on its own.