Some interesting numbers?

[Lucky]

I noticed this a little while ago, and I'm not sure if the math is correct, but it reminded me of some of the Nova cannon calculation done for 40K.

http://forums.spacebattles.com/showthre ... ost5673294

KE of P/Q torpedo case impacting shields/hull
Photon/Quantum torpedo case=247.5 kg
v=.25c
KE=166 MT
KEt(plus explosive yield of antimatter or zpe) =230 MT
v=.75c (combat speed)
KE=1497 MT
KEt=1561 MT

[Mike DiCenso]

Using

K = 1/2 * mv^2

m = 247 kilogram = 247 kilogram
v = 74,818 kilometer/second = 74,818,000 meter/second


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Solution:
kinetic energy (K) = 6.91320040814E+17 joule or about 1,649 megatons (1.649 GT).


So that first set of calcs was way off.
-Mike

[User1356]

Using

K = 1/2 * mv^2

m = 247 kilogram = 247 kilogram
v = 74,818 kilometer/second = 74,818,000 meter/second


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Solution:
kinetic energy (K) = 6.91320040814E+17 joule or about 1,649 megatons (1.649 GT).


So that first set of calcs was way off.
-Mike

no your definition of a megaton etc. is. offhand your energy figure looks to be about 166 MT using the scientific definition

[Praeothmin]

The speed is too high, no torpedoes fired, except when stated going at Warp, have ever been shown to fly 0.25c...

[Mike DiCenso]

Using

K = 1/2 * mv^2

m = 247 kilogram = 247 kilogram
v = 74,818 kilometer/second = 74,818,000 meter/second


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Solution:
kinetic energy (K) = 6.91320040814E+17 joule or about 1,649 megatons (1.649 GT).


So that first set of calcs was way off.
-Mike

no your definition of a megaton etc. is. offhand your energy figure looks to be about 166 MT using the scientific definition

Please provide proof that I'm wrong in that, Skooj. A megaton is 4.184×10e15 J or about 4,184 terajoules.
-Mike

[Mike DiCenso]

The speed is too high, no torpedoes fired, except when stated going at Warp, have ever been shown to fly 0.25c...

Bull.

- The torpedo fired on Armus' postion in "Skin of Evil" travels from tens of thousands of km in a fraction of a second.

-The torpedoes fired in TNG's "Half a Life" accelerate after launch from a relative deadstop E-D to reach the target star at least 4 million kilometers away (assuming that star was a red dwarf to be conservative) in just 18 seconds or 222,222 kps.

-Mike

[Praeothmin]

The speed is too high, no torpedoes fired, except when stated going at Warp, have ever been shown to fly 0.25c...

Bull.

- The torpedo fired on Armus' postion in "Skin of Evil" travels from tens of thousands of km in a fraction of a second.
-Mike

Where was the distance calculated?

-The torpedoes fired in TNG's "Half a Life" accelerate after launch from a relative deadstop E-D to reach the target star at least 4 million kilometers away (assuming that star was a red dwarf to be conservative) in just 18 seconds or 222,222 kps.

Is it possible it went to low Warp?
After all, IIRC, torpedoes have a "Warp Sustainer engine", do they not?
Does it only sustain them in Warp, or does it also allow them to go to Warp?

[Mr. Oragahn]

Well, a ship could be at warp without moving much, like the E-D. It would help explain the oddities of super fast torps which can be counted on the hands of... what?
There may be those torpedoes fired by the Defiant, after an order given by Sisko, and used to spread some poison I think. Globally they seemed quite fast, although under the two cases named by Mike.

[Mike DiCenso]

Where was the distance calculated?

It's easy enough to see, even without detailed calculations:







Most of the planet is completely visible in all but the E-D's viewscreen as it orbits the planet, and there is no indication of a change in orbital altitude, either.

-The torpedoes fired in TNG's "Half a Life" accelerate after launch from a relative deadstop E-D to reach the target star at least 4 million kilometers away (assuming that star was a red dwarf to be conservative) in just 18 seconds or 222,222 kps.[/quote

Is it possible it went to low Warp?
After all, IIRC, torpedoes have a "Warp Sustainer engine", do they not?
Does it only sustain them in Warp, or does it also allow them to go to Warp?

Possible what went to low warp? The torpedoes? Sure, but the timing of how long it takes for the torpedoes to accelerate and reach the star are pretty straight-forward, and there is no evidence the E-D hereself is at warp when it launched them as seen here:



So it boils down to the fact that the torpedoes are doing a significant fraction of c all on their own since the E-D appears to be stationary relative to the star.
-Mike

[Mike DiCenso]

Well, a ship could be at warp without moving much, like the E-D. It would help explain the oddities of super fast torps which can be counted on the hands of... what?
There may be those torpedoes fired by the Defiant, after an order given by Sisko, and used to spread some poison I think. Globally they seemed quite fast, although under the two cases named by Mike.

Similar ranges and velocities are seen in the DS9 episodes "For the Uniform" as well as "The Die is Cast".
-Mike

[Praeothmin]

Ok, then Torpedoes can go very fast, apparently simply not in combat... :)

[Mike DiCenso]

Oh yes they do. In TOS' "The Changeling", during the battle with Nomad, the E-1701 drops from warp to divert that power to the shields, it shoots a torpedo at the 1.5 thing, and hits it few seconds later a stated range of 90,000 km.

In TNG's "The Wounded", the USS Phoenix fires on the Cardassian ships at ranges of 200,000 km with photon torpedoes, and scores hits with a second or so of firing.
-Mike

[Praeothmin]

True, I forgot about those two examples.
But in DS9, all the battles show us slower torpedoes.
This comes back to a debate we had some months back, where we kept going over the fact that torpedoes are apparently capable of high speeds, but most of the time don't always go that fast...

[Picard]

DS9 is not best example at hand - it is done by VFX supervisor who really liked screwing things up. Plus TNG overrides DS9, and it seems that both phasers and torpedoes are able to change velocity - in "Wounded", both phasers and photon torpedoes are way faster than they are in DS9 and TNG knife-fights. However, since both shields and phasers have subspace component (I analyzed it at my site) it might be that faster phasers = weaker subspace component, which makes it preferable to use slower weapons at lower ranges.

[Praeothmin]

DS9 is not best example at hand - it is done by VFX supervisor who really liked screwing things up. Plus TNG overrides DS9,

Says who?
You?
DS9 came after TNG, so if any series overrides another, it would be DS9 overriding TNG.
The fact you don't like DS9's way of doing things doesn't matter.
What matters is we see how fast Torpedoes go in most fights, and aside from a few examples of hight speeds, they go much, much slower than in "The Wounded"...