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The second nuTrek movie : Into Dorkness 
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Starship Captain
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Well, the Volcano was a Toba-level event, if not greater. Any volcano threatening to wipe out all life on a planet is bound to have a ton of heat. Besides, it's not the lava that's dangerous, although there is a lot of that. It's the pyroclastic flows. My guess is that the volcano was going to deliver a huge amount of both. Not to mention that it's much denser than the air during re-entry.


Tue May 28, 2013 4:40 am
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Jedi Master

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Actually, they say the heat would be too much to handle, but the shuttle's only issue when it was in the Volcano was with the dust that clogged up the engines.
They never mention the hull heating up too much or anything else, and frankly, if Spock's suit can handle the heat, so should the Enterprise's hull...

Watchdog wrote:
Kirk himself was a bit surprising, but only a bit. He's way more reckless than Kirk-prime was, I chalk that up to the fact that this guy went from the academy straight into being captain wheras Kirk-prime rose through the ranks and got the benefit of experience before becoming captain.
Kirk-prime is a seasoned pro wheras Nu-Kirk is basically just a wunderkind.


I agree, but at the same time, I see some traces of the Shat-Kirk in Pine's portrayal, making me believe Shat-Kirk would be just as reckless had he been thrust in the same situation as Pine-Kirk...

Spock kicks some serious ass, and Khan is the ultimate bad-ass...

Quote:
What did everyone think of the look of the Klingons?


Loved them, they looked like a cross between TNG Klingons and TMP's Klingons...
About their ships, on the other hand, I'm still not sure what my feelings are...

And I don't care about any scathing review, I loved it...
Yes, it has flaws and plot holes, but then again, so did TwoK and TUC, the two best Trek movies IMO...


Tue May 28, 2013 12:40 pm
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Jedi Knight

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Yeah I loved Spock fighting Khan, they're pretty well matched although Khan was way more agressive and head crushy.
These new treks never made a big deal out of Vulcans being stronger than humans, but we see Spock's punches had an effect on Khan when Kirks did not.


Tue May 28, 2013 8:32 pm
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Jedi Master

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watchdog wrote:
Yeah I loved Spock fighting Khan, they're pretty well matched although Khan was way more agressive and head crushy.
These new treks never made a big deal out of Vulcans being stronger than humans, but we see Spock's punches had an effect on Khan when Kirks did not.


Well, the first one showed us Spock beating Kirk effortlessly while the human security guards had trouble with him, and the Romulans were shown as much stronger than humans...
The Klingons were shown stronger than humans as well in this movie...

For all its plot holes/weak scenario (which I don't think are that weak), at least these Trek movies display with consistency what was only mostly implied and sporadically shown in the shows: Vulcans, Romulans and Klingons are much stronger than humans, and in HtH fights, Humans will usually get the worst of it unless really good, like Sulu...

I also loved that Uhura, after beaming right next to Khan, didn't hesitate before firing at him, and didn't stop after the first one for a full minute to see if her stun shots had any effects...
She fired until Spock came back up and knocked Khan out using his version of iron-knuckles... :)


Wed May 29, 2013 12:42 pm
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Jedi Knight

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The Klingons were shown to be stronger than humans’ way back in Star Trek 3 when Kruge lifts Kirk off the ground while choking him, years later we see Worf do something similar to some guy who was trying to goad him. To my knowledge however, the 2009 movie was the first establishment of the Romulans being stronger as well.
I get a little disappointed that Nu-Kirk is not that good in a fight, almost everyone he's gotten into a fist-fight with has kicked his ass. Kirk-prime never had that problem, in fact the only time I ever saw him get pummeled in a fight was the two or three times he had to fight Spock (RSK apparently has no effect against the Spock factor).
But as I stated previously, I chalk that up to Nu-Kirk not having anywhere near the same level of experience that Kirk-prime had; finishing at Starfleet Academy, having several tours of duty on various starships, returning to the academy as an instructor for a brief period etc. Not to mention that his father was there for him growing up (don’t know what George and Wynona Kirk were during that Kodos the executioner thing when Kirk-prime was 13 though).

While I enjoyed the movie and rather liked the misdirection as to Khan, one thing that did sort of bother me was the fact that Khan is supposed to be of Indian origin. Some of the non-cannon books claim that he was a Sikh and while Ricardo Montalban was not Indian, his Spanish accent does sound close to the accent you would get from someone from India. Cumberbach has a very definite English accent as well as blue eyes, so very different really.
I stated above that I like the interiors of the ship and still sort of hate the exterior. I’m glad they decided to make engineering look a little less like a brewery. The warp core was a lot more interesting this time around and done in a different enough way to set it apart from all the warp cores that we’ve seen before (add to that the fact that it is an actual working scientific machine). I would love to see a cutaway for this new ship or even get an idea about how big it really is compared to the original Enterprise.


Wed May 29, 2013 1:29 pm
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Jedi Master

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Actually, Watchdog, Nu-Kirk is very good in his fights against human opponents...
He only struggles against stronger foes, but even then, he did pretty well against the Klingons, all things considered...
In the first movie, while drunk, he did give bloody noses to 4 opponents...
The Section 31 guards he was against were knocked out, he even got to help Scotty...

Watchdog wrote:
The Klingons were shown to be stronger than humans’ way back in Star Trek 3 when Kruge lifts Kirk off the ground while choking him, years later we see Worf do something similar to some guy who was trying to goad him


Which is why I said:
Me wrote:
what was only mostly implied and sporadically shown in the shows


:-)

Apart from the occasional shows where superior strength was shown, most of the time, we got shows like DS9 where Kyra was shown to be strong enough to beat Klingons in HtH...


Wed May 29, 2013 5:23 pm
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Jedi Master

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Lucky wrote:
Praeothmin wrote:
Haven't seen it, want to see it, and I know I will love it, because I'm not old and grumpy like Mr. O... ;-P

At worst, it's a fun action flick.

Someone really needs to explain what cold fusion is to hollywood. A cold fusion bomb will not freeze a volcano. ^_^

The idea of stealth interplanetary torpedos was interesting.

It almost seems like the NUfeds use something like a quantum slipstream drive.

Have we ever seen the Enterprise's shields stop an attack in any of the new movies? >_<

Cocytus wrote:
People need to explain a hell of a lot of things to Hollywood, like when Scotty said he would "suffocate, freeze and explode" when exposed to space. I've only seen it once, but if memory serves they were between the earth and the moon when he said that, so he'd be in full view of the sun, making freezing unlikely, and certainly never instantaneous. Vacuums are insulators, after all. Suffocation, yes. Exploding? No.

Scotty is an engineer and a human so i find that sort of thing forgivable. He isn't a science officer, nor does he talk in a technical manner anyway, and it is unimportant.

Calling a bomb that freezes things a cold fusion bomb is just strange.

The plot point that the volcano will destroy the planet sounds like what was happening in Pen-pals.


Thu May 30, 2013 3:00 am
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Watchdog wrote:
The Klingons were shown to be stronger than humans’ way back in Star Trek 3 when Kruge lifts Kirk off the ground while choking him, years later we see Worf do something similar to some guy who was trying to goad him. To my knowledge however, the 2009 movie was the first establishment of the Romulans being stronger as well.


Kruge actually struggled some to pick Kirk up a little ways, he didn't effortlessly do so, like the way Khan did in TWoK with Chekov, who was also in a heavy spacesuit at the time, and Khan held Chekov at arm's length for a considerably longer time and was not enraged. The only time we have seen a similar feat from a Klingon is when Worf lifts up Fullerton and holds him at arm's length.

What Kruge does in TSFS is what I would expect of any highly conditioned human, but what word does in the DS9 episode is truly super-human.

Now with the Klingons, I can see the differences being explained that the Klingon's Augment virus gave some of the afflicted super-strength, even after Dr. Phlox's cure was instituted.

As for Kirk getting beaten up so much. I'd like to follow up on what Praeo wrote, by pointing out that Kirk in TOS got beaten up a fair number of times himself, it's just that you don't remember it, because you only remember when he did win (usually at the end of an episode). An example of this is when Kirk is up against the Gorn in "Arena", he can't beat up the Gorn, it's just too tough and too strong for him to take on toe-to-toe, which is why he has to build the bamboo canon.
-Mike


Thu May 30, 2013 6:38 pm
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Jedi Knight

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Mike DiCenso wrote:
As for Kirk getting beaten up so much. I'd like to follow up on what Praeo wrote, by pointing out that Kirk in TOS got beaten up a fair number of times himself, it's just that you don't remember it, because you only remember when he did win (usually at the end of an episode). An example of this is when Kirk is up against the Gorn in "Arena", he can't beat up the Gorn, it's just too tough and too strong for him to take on toe-to-toe, which is why he has to build the bamboo canon.
-Mike

I disagree. Against a regular humanoid enemy, unless Kirk was outnumbered, he could usually hold his ground pretty well. I recall the fake Andorian guy stabbed him in the back in "Journey to Babel" but Kirk turned right around an knocked him out before passing out himself. Aside from incidents like that, Kirk one-on-one (not fighting a killer croc) could usually deal out the ass whippings, heck that episode that featured Lincoln kirk tried to punch the rock-like alien that instigated the whole conflict.


Fri May 31, 2013 7:09 am
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Jedi Master

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Kirk did lose his first fight against the Captain of the Exeter, Ron Tracey, in "The Omega Glory"...
In fact, Kirk got his ass handed to him a couple of times in that episode, IIRC...


Fri May 31, 2013 2:59 pm
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Admiral
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Lucky wrote:
Praeothmin wrote:
Haven't seen it, want to see it, and I know I will love it, because I'm not old and grumpy like Mr. O... ;-P

At worst, it's a fun action flick.

Someone really needs to explain what cold fusion is to hollywood. A cold fusion bomb will not freeze a volcano. ^_^


Try a Hot Solidification next time, it can, err, melt ice caps I think.

Oh and fans who thought Hollyshit would be smart not to redo Khan had found, in Memory Alpha, a character who would have been a good pick for the vilian.

But from what I read, it was Khan?
Is that a joke?


Sun Jun 02, 2013 3:52 pm
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Praeothmin wrote:
For all its plot holes/weak scenario (which I don't think are that weak), at least these Trek movies display with consistency what was only mostly implied and sporadically shown in the shows: Vulcans, Romulans and Klingons are much stronger than humans, and in HtH fights, Humans will usually get the worst of it unless really good, like Sulu...


Trouble is, the seasoned Prime Kirk (and his crew) mastered powerful techniques unknown to pretty boy and his haircut club.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZM7Af_DOnQ

Better rip off that plot next time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-WBKah3uwg


Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:29 pm
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Praeothmin wrote:
Humans will usually get the worst of it unless really good, like Sulu.


Funny you bring that up, as Kirk also did all right against the other Romulan mook.
-Mike


Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:28 pm
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Jedi Master

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Mike DiCenso wrote:
Praeothmin wrote:
Humans will usually get the worst of it unless really good, like Sulu.


Funny you bring that up, as Kirk also did all right against the other Romulan mook.
-Mike


You mean the Romulan Sulu had to stab in the back in order to save Kirk's life? ;-P


Tue Jun 04, 2013 5:35 pm
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Jedi Knight

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Praeothmin wrote:
Mike DiCenso wrote:
Praeothmin wrote:
Humans will usually get the worst of it unless really good, like Sulu.


Funny you bring that up, as Kirk also did all right against the other Romulan mook.
-Mike


You mean the Romulan Sulu had to stab in the back in order to save Kirk's life? ;-P
In all fairness Kirk had been fighting and holding his own against two Romulans just moments before, and wasn't doing to poorly until getting rolled of the Romulan's back and kicked which was unfortunately close to the edge. All of this after crashing into the platform and bouncing around a lot.


Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:08 am
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