Worf vs T'ealc

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:12 pm

From a thread I saw at Spacebattles.

Two scenarios:

1-Unarmed, in an open area.

2-T'ealc with a non-operationnal staff (can only use it as a Staff) and Worf with a Bath'Leth.

Who wins?

Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 12:35 am

Could you please provide a link to this SB.com thread?
-Mike

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:24 pm

Here's the link:
http://kier.3dfrontier.com/forums/showt ... p?t=131161

I can't really say anything over the outcome since I've only recently started to watch Stargate, and up to now, T'ealc hasn't really demonstrated anything in HtH.

He's shown good accuracy vs other Go'Aulds, although he was very close to them at that time (in the pilot, when he helps O'neill and the others escape), and they weren't dodging at all.

I will say though, that I think in this case the Bath'Leth would be a better weapon then the staff.
Once you're inside the staff's range, you have a better weapon that can cut and hurt a lot even without to much force behind it.
At least, moreso then with a staff.

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 5:11 pm

Watch The Warrior, season 5, for the Joma Secu and see Teal'c fight against a skilled Goa'uld, using the mastaba technique (same name than the flat structures, go figure, maybe because the way a staff is used to hit is like a big slap?).

Though the Bat thing looks a tad cumbersome, it's made of metal and has plenty of sharp bits, the staff is possibly lighter and about concussion force.

A shitty video, with spoilers about the episode in question:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJO4bln-U5s

Post by **Mike DiCenso** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 11:35 pm

I haven't seen anything in all of Stargate that makes Teal'c look all that much better than Worf in hand-to-hand fighting, nor anything to obvious that that I can recall that makes Teal'c stronger than Worf, either.

Longer lifespan? If Worf is like Kor, Kang, and Koloth, he will have at least a 120 year lifespan. For clarification, are we talking a fight between Worf and Teal'c when he still had his Goa'uld symbiote, or the Teal'c post-tretonin? Big difference there.

Both men are highly honorable, lawful, and skilled warriors in their respecitive catagories. Because of their nature it is unlikely depending on the circumstances of this fight that either of them will pull seriously dirty tricks.

In terms of a bat'leth versus the staff that Teal'c carries, I think each of those weapons have their own unique advantages and disadvantages. A bat'leth, for instance, if wielded properly, can not only be used as a sword or for bludgeoning, but it has hook shapes that can be used to disarm a regular sword, or even a staff.

In terms of range, I don't know why Worf would get a TOS-era phaser as opposed to a TNG one; but that is still one helluva advantage in many ways over the zat gun as Worf, if he were so inclined (read he does somthing he would consider dishonorable), could just end the fight by stunning Teal'c on widespread stun, or even just vaporize Teal'c with a single shot, whereas Teal'c might have to hit Worf a couple times with the zat gun to just to knock him out, and it will take three hits to disintegrate Worf. Teal'c because of his Jaffa abilites, is likely a more accurate shot than Worf is.
-Mike

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 3:15 am

Have we seen people resist phaser stuns?
Worf may have to recalibrate his phaser quickly to really knock Teal'c off.

That said, a single zat hit, if it doesn't knock one out, it clearly immobilizes someone with great pain. At that point, the second shot is easy.

Besides, zat can stun tough men in one shot. They got poor maybe just once in fact, and that was against O'neill.

Hand to hand, I think Worf takes it. But in firefights, there's just no way. Teal'c fires eyes closed or even in his back with a staff, and can score hits at a dozen of meters behind him. He's been through so many battles, there's no competition. Teal'c would handle that one easily.

Gateworld video.

The zat also has a funny effect: if it hits metal, it spreads very well, up to the point where it can run along a thick metal beam for ten meters, and still stun a person close to that beam. The density, volume, compactness and assembly of an object and its materials matters a lot in how much you can saturate said object.
The metal beam was pure, massive and narrow, so the energy salvo ran down rather easily.
We see a bolt hit a jeep and knock a guy back. He walks up. The jeep is made of several materials, different densities and all that jazz, so the effect was largely diluted.
A shot in the nearby ground or a wall would have no disintegrating effect, unless, I suppose, you really fire like crazy and probably have other people joining in and doing the same.

Post by **Trinoya** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 4:27 am

This comes down to the symbiote. If tealc has it, he wins effortlessly. If he doesn't have it, Worf Wins after a bit of a seriously long fight.

Neither will kill the other.

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 4:33 pm

Mr. Oragahn wrote:Have we seen people resist phaser stuns?

Roga Danar, but he was genetically engineered to be tougher to everything.

But we do see Worf resist the tough of 2 Klingon pain sticks at a time, and go down a row of Klingons where he gets hit with at least half a dozen times (at least 12 pain sticks then) and Mile O'Brien said that each of these pain sticks could stock some sort of Bull dead in its tracks...

And I've youtubed a little for Teal'c.
I've found a video where we see him invade a temple, kill a lot of guards and get taken down.
He is tough and a good fighter, but the shots he received from the staffs seemed to be powered down shots, because all his shots blew up his opponents, and destroyed sizeable parts of the pillars he hid behind (or the ones his opponents hid behind, 'cause Teal'c didn't all "1-shot" them).
Yet when he gets hit, the shots don't blow up as much, and instead of having a huge whole blown into his torso, he has small wounds.

Teal'c fires eyes closed or even in his back with a staff, and can score hits at a dozen of meters behind him. He's been through so many battles, there's no competition. Teal'c would handle that one easily.

Yes, Teal'c is quite good with his Staff, but even in the first season's episodes I've watched so far, he still misses.
And Worf's been in many fights as well, all along TNG, and then DS9, and the more we see him, the better he gets, so I wouldn't be so quick as to give this one to Teal'c either.

But again, this is just a first impression.
I've seen a lot more Worf then I've seen Teal'c, so your assessment may as well be good... :)

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:55 pm

Praeothmin wrote: Yes, Teal'c is quite good with his Staff, but even in the first season's episodes I've watched so far, he still misses.
And Worf's been in many fights as well, all along TNG, and then DS9, and the more we see him, the better he gets, so I wouldn't be so quick as to give this one to Teal'c either.

But again, this is just a first impression.
I've seen a lot more Worf then I've seen Teal'c, so your assessment may as well be good... :)

They both miss from time to time, rather rarely, but Teal'c is just in the league above. He has far more experience in gunfights than Worf could ever hope of.
In that department, Teal'c is the clear favourite. Not in the other.

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 2:19 pm

Mr. Oragahn wrote:He has far more experience in gunfights than Worf

This puzzles me.
What gives you that impression?
We've seen Worf in many "phaser-fights" throughout TNG (series and movies) and DS9.

So what makes you say Teal'c has more experience?
(really curious)

Mr. Oragahn · Post by **Mr. Oragahn** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 3:57 pm

Praeothmin wrote:
Mr. Oragahn wrote:He has far more experience in gunfights than Worf
This puzzles me.
What gives you that impression?
We've seen Worf in many "phaser-fights" throughout TNG (series and movies) and DS9.

So what makes you say Teal'c has more experience?
(really curious)

Because those Jaffa fight early in their lives, they go at real combat around what would be the age of 18, or early, and Teal'c is particularily old. Not as Bra'tac, who was 137 years old in season 5 I think, but you can easily give Teal'c a well likely 20-30 years of constant ground combat, at least (what a shitty life). Trained by Apophis' First Prime, until he'd become one himself.

EDIT: Strike that. Actually, in The Light (season 4, a great episode, very calm), Teal'c says he's 101 years old. So that would give him, at the very least, 70-80 years of experience.

Praeothmin · Post by **Praeothmin** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:24 pm

OK.
Thanks!