The Zerg in the GFFA

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Admiral Breetai
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The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Admiral Breetai » Fri Jul 22, 2011 11:29 pm

kerrigan and her assets from sc2 show up in the unknown regions primarily on asteroids and uncharted worlds around 60 BBY then around 22 BBY a separatist fleet fleeing Republic fleet ends up in Zerg space, assaulting the ships kerrigan learns of the war and leads her hordes to the conflict.

they infest Bastion and various other outer rim worlds before the puppet master behind the war finds out. (several Jedi have been infested as well)

how can the galaxy counter?

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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Admiral Breetai » Fri Jul 29, 2011 7:03 pm

no takers?

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Mr. Oragahn
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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:12 pm

Not much Crafties on that board! :)
Plus I don't think Starcraft is worth a versus debate. Not only the background material trying hard to stick to game mechanics produce silly things, but the way the background itself evolved with SC2, with for example those cracked open or "ecumenopolized" planets exploited/terraformed by the Terrans, should make anyone still possessing a nut of common sense and logic just not bother at all.

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Khas
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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Khas » Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:14 pm

Please, I've heard of far, far more ridiculous things from other sci-fi universes *coughDoctorWhocough*, like a modified World War II fighter being able to take out Dalek cruisers.

Most of the silliness comes from the Terrans, as the Protoss are hella advanced (and their buildings are said to warp in troops and vehicles from other Protoss planets), and the Zerg are like an insect hive.

Even then on Korhal, the ecumenopolis planet, we see large chunks of what appear to be desert. That, and it's listed that Korhal's population is only 6.3 billion. Less than modern-day Earth, and certainly less than a normal ecumenopolis world.

As for New Folsom, with the thousands of miles of framework, it's been said that that planet was geologically unstable, and it's also possible that carbon nanotubes were used in those wires' construction.

And Mr. O, you want silly? On ASVS, Prophet of Truth has tried quantifying Invader Zim, a children's cartoon.

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Mr. Oragahn
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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Tue Aug 09, 2011 7:08 pm

Picking Doctor Who as an excuse doesn't work. You don't use bad to excuse bad, really.
Doctor Who has the entire power of the United States running through small wires stuck on a wall and sucked by a Dalek by smashing his pumping thing through a computer connected to those wires. Etc.
Even then on Korhal, the ecumenopolis planet, we see large chunks of what appear to be desert. That, and it's listed that Korhal's population is only 6.3 billion. Less than modern-day Earth, and certainly less than a normal ecumenopolis world.
The Terrans never had any huge infrastructure to begin with, and certainly nothing to turn such a planet into a largely metal covered world in little time. They go from a total wasteland of a former planet populated by only millions of people, to this, in what? Four years or so? I won't even comment on the process of settling such a world so that billions of people go to it. There's not even a single bit of logic, no matter the money, that would make sane people want to set foot upon a world that was formerly battered by nuclear firepower.

But that silliness really pales in light of New Folsom. The size of the infrastructure involved there, or the mere idiotic idea of even trying to maintain a planet open and even pretending having the materials and energy to do so, that is a new definition of cretinous.
I mean, the planet is literally cracked open and there are like beams and stitches that supposedly keep the core accessible!
Even a facepalm with a galaxy of goo crammed in between wouldn't suffice to describe the vast lack of sense of scale and consistency the people penning SC's background suffer from.

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Khas
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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Khas » Tue Aug 09, 2011 11:49 pm

The Protoss and the Zerg are still quantifiable though.

And this is Earth at night. It's also possible, given Mengsk's personality, that a lot of that light is for show, to make Korhal seem more inviting.

As for the background material trying to fit game mechanics, was the only bit of SC background material you've read "Shadow of the Xel'Naga"? Beacause the other books aren't like that at all. Not to mention I don't think the manual's backstory was game-mechanic-filled.

And about New Folsom:
A: It's smaller than Mars.
B: As I've said before, there could be a metric fuckton of carbon nanotubes that make up those supports. I've seen the possibility of building a carbon nanotube space elevator seriously be considered before.
C: New Folsom was geologically unstable.
D: It gets pummelled by asteroids.
E: As to the energy used to suppport it, I'm gonna go use the same explanation that KSW used to explain how the Death Star blows up planets: Geothermal energy.

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mojo
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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by mojo » Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:02 am

hey, damn it! invader zim is NOT a children's cartoon. invader zim was an attempt by vasquez to create a children's cartoon, but he was in no way successful, as he simply couldn't tone himself down far enough. it's true that zim is for children as opposed to any of his other work, but that's like saying late night cinemax is a children's program as opposed to hardcore pornography.
it's weird that you bring up zim, though, because for some reason i always mix up zerg/irkin. i thought this thread was ABOUT zim when i first saw it.

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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:08 pm

I wish I had the will to spare you, but your miserable attempt at justifying any absurd piece of fluff shall never be met with the slightest ounce of pity.
Prepare to die!
Khas wrote:The Protoss and the Zerg are still quantifiable though.
OK. But that means not using anything that's obtained by using Terran industrial might.
This kind of acrobatic cherry picking will get old before you can think about it.
And this is Earth at night.
Still a small portion of Korhal's urban area. Also, a large part of Earth isn't covered with tall metallic structures : the levels on Korhal show that the bottom is all hazy and not visible. Not all sections of the ecumenopolis might look like that though. But if we look at how things happen on Earth, there's a lot of time to go by before we get to the point, or the need, to build such high and cramped cities, so tight that people are actually desperate enough to actually have to spend their time on the roofs of the super city, so much that there are entire flat sections that are vast enough to be playable areas without ravines to completely isolate entire sections of the maps, so vast that they build large gardens on top of them.
Not even the densest section of Tokyo reaches that extreme state.
The point is relatively clear: if they built that section of the ecunemopolis that way, it is because they had to cram that many people in such small areas.
Which is in fact another silly aspect of new Korhal: there's no reason to cram so many people when you have an entire planet at your disposal, and when you have actually rebuilt an urban area over like a full third of the planet's surface, at the very least. Even less when you have only a few billions of people to settle.

And of course, rooftops are full of crystals and gas! But perhaps those things tend to regrow stupidly fast. Then, of course, this begs the question as to why be so concerned about exploiting them and fight for planets if such resources just happen to renew themselves naturally...

Earth, on the other hand, took us a full century of industrial process to get built up, and we worked out from the already existing even older cities in many places. And, in the end, only a few areas ever approach the kind of urbanization of Korhal. Such places would simply be any city where there's just plenty of tall skyscrappers.
It's also possible, given Mengsk's personality, that a lot of that light is for show, to make Korhal seem more inviting.
Oh come on. If by possible you mean as likely as man terraforming Venus at the end of the week.
Evidence from the game shows that it's more than a mere New Las Vegas light show.
As for the background material trying to fit game mechanics, was the only bit of SC background material you've read "Shadow of the Xel'Naga"? Beacause the other books aren't like that at all. Not to mention I don't think the manual's backstory was game-mechanic-filled.
In about every single large versus thread, those issues crop up. The most amusing being the small creatures on the ground taking down what is meant to be big ass ships.
And about New Folsom:
A: It's smaller than Mars.
B: As I've said before, there could be a metric fuckton of carbon nanotubes that make up those supports. I've seen the possibility of building a carbon nanotube space elevator seriously be considered before.
C: New Folsom was geologically unstable.
D: It gets pummelled by asteroids.
E: As to the energy used to suppport it, I'm gonna go use the same explanation that KSW used to explain how the Death Star blows up planets: Geothermal energy.
A: yes, but that doesn't change a thing. Had you said it was smaller than the Death Star, then somehow, we might have begun going somewhere. But it is not. The amount of infrastructure involved there is just silly. There's not a single ounce of logic in spending so much resources that way. When you can build that kind of structure around a small planet, you can strip mine it very easily without actually doing that kind of nonsensical crap.
B: if you're speaking of the strength, a space elevator is not the same thing, if only for a mere question of mass and gravity. Your space elevator is nothing more than a tube linking something on the ground to something in orbit. Here we're talking about lengthy structures which are like dozens of kilometers wide, and either circling the planet or connecting two side of the open ravines.
C: that changes nothing. An unstable planet will be subject to large seismic activity. It ends there. Obviously, a civilization that can do that to a planet won't be bothered by a few volcanoes and earthquakes. It will also not bother to actually keep the crust open in such a way that it miraculously prevent the hundreds of kilometers tall cliffs to collapse on themselves. Contrary to popular belief, past a certain scale, a planet is nothing more than aggregated pebbles. The only way to prevent the planet from collapsing, short of mega force fields (which we didn't see any evidence of, mere shields being quite a rare sight for Terrans), you'd have to pave the walls of those giant ravines (leading straight to the exposed core) with super materials, then build a mesh over it and a network of beams and structure to prevent all this crap from falling, up to the point where you realize that the sheer amount of artificial structures needed to maintain the nation sized walls from crumbling will actually crumble under their own weight and also add to the local gravity.
D: and? so they bother building a superstructure around and inside the planet, yet mere asteroids which they can easily intercept or even shield themselves from with those super structures, still represent an issue?
E: sure, what a wasteful project (not to say that I don't see any evidence that they're efficiently taping the geothermal energy). What kind of society would use such an advanced power and immense set of capabilities and yet still need the particular resources of a single planet? It's like being able to build a time traveling, black hole busting neutronium enriched super Death Star, yet make a fuss about exploiting a planet full of a *most important* chemical that's just as good as coal.

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Khas
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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Khas » Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:47 am

The Terran Confederacy originally controlled New Folsom, although it never said when they first settled. Seeing as the Confederacy stood from 2323 to 2500, it's possible that what they did to that planet took decades to accomplish. Just like how the Alliance in Firefly took decades to make every terrestrial planet or moon in its system Earth-like. And considering that there are many major worlds in Alliance space, that is no small feat. So you tell me, in a span of decades, which is more ridiculous, creating a gridwork that makes up a good chunk of a single planet's crust, or terraforming "dozens of planets, and hundreds of moons"?

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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Mr. Oragahn » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:10 pm

Khas wrote:The Terran Confederacy originally controlled New Folsom, although it never said when they first settled. Seeing as the Confederacy stood from 2323 to 2500, it's possible that what they did to that planet took decades to accomplish. Just like how the Alliance in Firefly took decades to make every terrestrial planet or moon in its system Earth-like. And considering that there are many major worlds in Alliance space, that is no small feat. So you tell me, in a span of decades, which is more ridiculous, creating a gridwork that makes up a good chunk of a single planet's crust, or terraforming "dozens of planets, and hundreds of moons"?
Sorry, but that's absurd logic. You won't make a case less stupid because you pick another case that's just equally or more stupid, eventually.
I couldn't care less about Firefry's background.
Decades won't cut it. Not only we didn't even see any evidence of a capacity to build that much stuff within decades, but it still completely fails to address all the basics that remain repelled from the gates of logic.
If Bizzness wanted to have super awesome planet, they should have done what anyone in SF does, be it pulp or not: let very advanced species handle the task, even if said species are gone now. Aren't there those Xel'naga which would have been very.
I'm not saying that Folsom would have been less stupid with the Xel, but at least we could say that the Xel had the resources, might and time to do achieve that pile of planetary nonsense.
Same for Korhal. They should have picked another planet and pretend that it was being built that way since a century at least, and that all the buildings had to be concentrated in some kind of giant ravine because random excuse X.

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Re: The Zerg in the GFFA

Post by Khas » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:34 pm

True, the Xel'Naga should have been the ones to do that to New Folsom. But we also don't know when New Folsom was colonized. It could have been in the early days of the Confederacy, which would be about the 2340s. In which case, they would have had about 160 years to do so.

I'll concede Korhal.

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