The Silverback replaces the AT-ST

[Lucky]

The VM-9L "Silverback" replaces all the AT-ST in the Star Wars movies. How does this change the out come of the events?

Edit
Scenario 1: As of the battle of Hoth the Silverbacks and everything needed to work them just appears replacing the AT-St equivalent, no one has any idea what the new vehicles and gear is able to do, but out of fear no one says anything, and they make the best of it.

The Rebels will be expecting AT-ST.

Scenario 2: As Scenario 1, but everyone knows exactly what they have.

Scenario 3: The Silverback and all the stuff needed to maintain it was created in-universe as a rival project to the AT-ST, and the Empire decided to go with the Silverback.

Scenario 4: As Scenario 3, but you are limited to Star Wars weapons.

Scenario 5: Run Scenario 1, 2, 3, and 4 as SDC

[Mr. Oragahn]

The Empire knows how to man those things?
Clearly, if they do, things could really be different at Endor.

[Kor_Dahar_Master]

In scenario 1, 2 and 3 the high cyclic rate of fire from their anti personel weaponry kicks ass, in 4 they get owned and i dunno what SDC is so meh.

[Lucky]

In scenario 1, 2 and 3 the high cyclic rate of fire from their anti personel weaponry kicks ass,

So how would they do on Hoth only at best having the vaguest of ideas as to how to drive the things? Could you be more descriptive?

in 4 they get owned

Why, it's still stupidly diffucult to damage compared to an AT-ST. It's just limited to Star Wars weapons, and the Rebels likely have an idea as to what such a vehicle can do.

i dunno what SDC is so meh.

It's basically a game mechanic used in some of the Palladium Books RPG. Robotech is one of their Mega-Damage universes.

SDC things are basically just mundane real worldish materials. There are no Mega-Damage things in the real world.

Here is a thread in which I'm working on figuring out how much energy is stored in an E-clip by finding out how many joules are in one MD point.
http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/view ... =12&t=1717

[Kor_Dahar_Master]

In scenario 1, 2 and 3 the high cyclic rate of fire from their anti personel weaponry kicks ass,

So how would they do on Hoth only at best having the vaguest of ideas as to how to drive the things? Could you be more descriptive?

I suppose it is about your level of understanding regarding tech, we are not talking cavemen with a aircraft we are talking about vehicle uswers with a different but understandable vehicle. After all even a guy from WW1 would know what end of a modern assault rifle to point at you and what happens when you pull the trigger.

Why, it's still stupidly diffucult to damage compared to an AT-ST. It's just limited to Star Wars weapons, and the Rebels likely have an idea as to what such a vehicle can do.

In 4 the rebels kick the crap out of it cos SW weapons are slow firing pieces of crap that are awful for anti-personel ect.


Ultimatly fights like on Endor would have been won by supplying the Empire with a couple of M134's and even some M61's on its vehicles, they would have raped the jedi on Geonosis as well.

[Lucky]

In scenario 1, 2 and 3 the high cyclic rate of fire from their anti personel weaponry kicks ass,

So how would they do on Hoth only at best having the vaguest of ideas as to how to drive the things? Could you be more descriptive?

I suppose it is about your level of understanding regarding tech, we are not talking cavemen with a aircraft we are talking about vehicle uswers with a different but understandable vehicle. After all even a guy from WW1 would know what end of a modern assault rifle to point at you and what happens when you pull the trigger.

I just can't see scenario 1 going smoothly.
The problem is we are talking about a transforming mecha that looks like small two seated all-terrain vehicle, and turns into a humanoid robot. Even if they can easily figure out how to drive it in vehicle mode they still won't be used to a walker with arms, and they won't know what all the stuff does.

The Silverback has feature I'm not sure exist in Star Wars, and they don't know how much fuel they have, and what sensors, or weapons. I basically made it so scenario 1 would go poorly as far as Hoth was concerned for all the At-St pilots.

Why, it's still stupidly diffucult to damage compared to an AT-ST. It's just limited to Star Wars weapons, and the Rebels likely have an idea as to what such a vehicle can do.

In 4 the rebels kick the crap out of it cos SW weapons are slow firing pieces of crap that are awful for anti-personel ect.

A silverback has four hard points to attach weapons(one on the hubcap), a modular rear equipment mount, and two arms in battloid mode. At worst it can just have lots of guns.

I think you are forgetting weapons like this from G and T levels of canon:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Z-6_rota ... ter_cannon
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Double-b ... ng_blaster
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/E-web_he ... ng_blaster

Then there is the composit beam lasers on the LAAT:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/LAAT#Weapons

Just because the AT-ST had certain weapons does not mean a silverback designed in Star Wars will be outfitted the same way.

Ultimatly fights like on Endor would have been won by supplying the Empire with a couple of M134's and even some M61's on its vehicles, they would have raped the jedi on Geonosis as well.

Star wars has those: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Z-6_rota ... ter_cannon

[Mike DiCenso]

SDC things are basically just mundane real worldish materials. There are no Mega-Damage things in the real world.

As far as Paladium rule mechanics, yes there are MDC things in the normal 21st century world. The classic example they give in many of the books for MDC is a tank. Knives, swords (regular bladed weapons not from the Paladium fantasy world), sling-shots, pistols, and machine guns, which are all SDC weapons, cannot do anything to a tank's armor because it is MDC. Weapons like RPGs, LAWs rockets, hand grenades, mines, artillery shells and so on are examples of MDC weapons.
-Mike

[Lucky]

SDC things are basically just mundane real worldish materials. There are no Mega-Damage things in the real world.

As far as Paladium rule mechanics, yes there are MDC things in the normal 21st century world. The classic example they give in many of the books for MDC is a tank. Knives, swords (regular bladed weapons not from the Paladium fantasy world), sling-shots, pistols, and machine guns, which are all SDC weapons, cannot do anything to a tank's armor because it is MDC. Weapons like RPGs, LAWs rockets, hand grenades, mines, artillery shells and so on are examples of MDC weapons.
-Mike

What book and hopefully page is that in?

Just having hundreds of SDC points does not make something MDC.

[Mike DiCenso]

Nearly every Paladium game book I've read has some reference or variation of the description, with the exception of the original Paladium Fantasy RPG, which was limited to SDC. I first read the "There you are, sitting inside a tank when..." scenario in the rifts corebook and "Beyond the Supernatural" (first addition) back in the early and mid 1980s. It is usually found in Combat Rules sections. In Rifts, in the Combat Rules for Hight-Tech War Machines section. So I don't know why you've never heard of, much less read it.

Just having hundreds of SDC points does not make something MDC.

Please, I've been playing Paladium RPG games since likely before you were born. I do know the difference, thank you very much.
-Mike

[Lucky]

Nearly every Paladium game book I've read has some reference or variation of the description, with the exception of the original Paladium Fantasy RPG, which was limited to SDC. I first read the "There you are, sitting inside a tank when..." scenario in the rifts corebook and "Beyond the Supernatural" (first addition) back in the early and mid 1980s. It is usually found in Combat Rules sections. In Rifts, in the Combat Rules for Hight-Tech War Machines section. So I don't know why you've never heard of, much less read it.

The Rifts Ultimate Edition says MDC materials are better then 21st Century tank armor.
http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/view ... =12&t=1717


I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I just want to see the quote.

[Mike DiCenso]

It's not a single quote, it's a two page description that is itself several full paragraphs. Also, be careful with your sources since it is well known that some Palladium books contradict each other on the same set of rules, even though they really shouldn't. It's likely in that case that the editor did not catch that statement and either adjust it, or cut it from the text. MDC applies to all reinforced structures or vehicles such that SDC weapons cannot hurt them. It does not matter whether that is a 21st century main battle tank and pillbox, or a glitterboy or Coalition powered armor suit. How much MDC each one has, especially given the size and other factors involved is where high-tech can come into play. Thus glitterboy armor may have the same MDC rating as a 21st century MBT, even though it is much smaller than the MBT, and a fraction of the mass.

You can find the section on pages 38-39 of the Rifts corebook. I'll type in the first opening sentences so you understand they are talking about a modern 20th/21st century tank:

"Consider this example with a contemporary M.D.C structure we all recognize, a tank. There you are, sitting inside a tank; a powerful heavily armored (M.D.C.) weapon. A kid walks up to your tank and begins to bounce a hard rubber ball against the hull of the tank. He can do this all day long without damaging the tank in the tinest way."

Is this what you wanted? It's fairly clear to me, and it's even more clear when this was published in "Beyond the Supernatural" which takes place in contemporary times (late 20th century to early 21st).
-Mike

[Lucky]

It's not a single quote, it's a two page description that is itself several full paragraphs. Also, be careful with your sources since it is well known that some Palladium books contradict each other on the same set of rules, even though they really shouldn't. It's likely in that case that the editor did not catch that statement and either adjust it, or cut it from the text. MDC applies to all reinforced structures or vehicles such that SDC weapons cannot hurt them. It does not matter whether that is a 21st century main battle tank and pillbox, or a glitterboy or Coalition powered armor suit. How much MDC each one has, especially given the size and other factors involved is where high-tech can come into play. Thus glitterboy armor may have the same MDC rating as a 21st century MBT, even though it is much smaller than the MBT, and a fraction of the mass.

You can find the section on pages 38-39 of the Rifts corebook. I'll type in the first opening sentences so you understand they are talking about a modern 20th/21st century tank:

"Consider this example with a contemporary M.D.C structure we all recognize, a tank. There you are, sitting inside a tank; a powerful heavily armored (M.D.C.) weapon. A kid walks up to your tank and begins to bounce a hard rubber ball against the hull of the tank. He can do this all day long without damaging the tank in the tinest way."

Is this what you wanted? It's fairly clear to me, and it's even more clear when this was published in "Beyond the Supernatural" which takes place in contemporary times (late 20th century to early 21st).
-Mike

What's the ISBN on the book you got the quote from? I'm asking because the only book that comes up when I google is an out of print book that I think was replaced by the Rifts Ultimate Edition.

I was under the impression that "Beyond the Supernatural" was a SDC setting?

Do you know what the "Compendium of Contemporary Weapons" says on the matter?